The HRT thread

Peter · Post by **Peter** » 27 Jun 2011, 21:52

If i'm right, Toyota, not being an engine supplier at the moment, would be able to have developed their engine, as they should have been free of the engine freeze. So they could learn from their mistakes and provide a new, more powerful engine. I don't remember Toyota running KERS in 2009, but if HRT can get KERS, they can more easily close the gap to the front, as they are missing out on 80hp for 6.6 seconds a lap without it. I think that KERS is maybe worth a second at least of time, provided they can keep an optimal balance on the car, as was the problem everyone who had KERS faced in 2009, especially Ferrari and McLaren.

S951 · Post by **S951** » 27 Jun 2011, 22:47

word is just engine and kers deal as toyota are seriously considering comeback supplier only

AndreaModa · Post by **AndreaModa** » 27 Jun 2011, 23:00

S951 wrote:word is just engine and kers deal as toyota are seriously considering comeback supplier only

And just where is this 'word' coming from my good man? I'd love to see Toyota back in the sport as another engine supplier, but I find it hard to believe they'd consider coming back supplying only one team, that being the one currently occupying the back of the grid.

I'd expect a much more coordinated approach, with them seeking out other teams to supply as well, a bit like Cosworth did in 2010 with Williams. Toyota will need, with no disrespect to HRT, a more frontrunning team with perhaps more sizeable resources behind it, to help with development and feedback. To come back with just one team would seem very unwise when they'd be up against the other manufacturers who each have at least two customer teams alongside a 'factory' effort (Williams in the case of Cosworth). In addition to that it would seem odd for a new manufacturer to enter the sport only two years before the engine regulations are to be completely overhauled.

Nothing more than a fanciful rumour in my opinion. Don't get me wrong I'd like to see it happen, but I highly doubt it will.

Phoenix · Post by **Phoenix** » 27 Jun 2011, 23:13

Toyota loves to burn money purposelessly, so why not?

AdrianSutil · Post by **AdrianSutil** » 28 Jun 2011, 01:57

It would be nice to see Toyota help HRT in some sort of technical/development scheme but the big problem for me at the moment is the awful race pace the cars have. Forget Canada, where the conditions levelled up the field, they were over a lap behind Virgin in Valencia. Qualifying pace is good, as Liuzzi easily has the measure of D'Ambrosio at most tracks, but if the race pace doesn't improve, forget about the whole 'getting close to Louts' dream.

Peter · Post by **Peter** » 28 Jun 2011, 03:01

AdrianSutil wrote:It would be nice to see Toyota help HRT in some sort of technical/development scheme but the big problem for me at the moment is the awful race pace the cars have. Forget Canada, where the conditions levelled up the field, they were over a lap behind Virgin in Valencia. Qualifying pace is good, as Liuzzi easily has the measure of D'Ambrosio at most tracks, but if the race pace doesn't improve, forget about the whole 'getting close to Louts' dream.

I think that this race was a one off for them. They have had problems with rear tyre overheating and wear all weekend. Narain did 3 stops, which is a lot more than the usual 1 stop or maybe 2 that they usually do at the back. I think Liuzzi did a 3 stopper as well.

AdrianSutil · Post by **AdrianSutil** » 28 Jun 2011, 03:06

Peter wrote:
AdrianSutil wrote:It would be nice to see Toyota help HRT in some sort of technical/development scheme but the big problem for me at the moment is the awful race pace the cars have. Forget Canada, where the conditions levelled up the field, they were over a lap behind Virgin in Valencia. Qualifying pace is good, as Liuzzi easily has the measure of D'Ambrosio at most tracks, but if the race pace doesn't improve, forget about the whole 'getting close to Louts' dream.

I think that this race was a one off for them. They have had problems with rear tyre overheating and wear all weekend. Narain did 3 stops, which is a lot more than the usual 1 stop or maybe 2 that they usually do at the back. I think Liuzzi did a 3 stopper as well.

Yeah I know they had a lot of tyre problems but still, they do struggle a lot in the races. They'll finish ahead of Virgin in the standings come season end, but I'm not expecting much more out of them. A point in a high-attrition race would be fantastic though.

David AGS · Post by **David AGS** » 29 Jun 2011, 11:34

Liuzzi said HRT may struggle at Silverstone due to the high downforce track, which is intersting as they should be bringing their new aero pack.

http://en.espnf1.com/hrtf1/motorsport/story/52857.html

But its good they are soon going to start on their 2012 car. It looks like there is light in the tunnell!

Mabe Liuzzi and Narain will stay on for next year too.

mediocre · Post by **mediocre** » 29 Jun 2011, 14:37

According to this (German), Kolles might go to Williams. And then...R.I.P. Williams F1 Team.

Klon · Post by **Klon** » 29 Jun 2011, 14:41

mediocre wrote:According to this (German), Kolles might go to Williams. And then...R.I.P. Williams F1 Team.

Yeah. Luckily this site can be considered quite a sucky source. :mrgreen:

mediocre · Post by **mediocre** » 29 Jun 2011, 14:45

Klon wrote:
mediocre wrote:According to this (German), Kolles might go to Williams. And then...R.I.P. Williams F1 Team.

Yeah. Luckily this site can be considered quite a sucky source.

True, especially that particular author. Btw, good to see you're from Flensberg - not toooooo far away from my home

Peter · Post by **Peter** » 29 Jun 2011, 21:41

mediocre wrote:According to this (German), Kolles might go to Williams. And then...R.I.P. Williams F1 Team.

I doubt that Williams would die, on the contrary, Kolles jumping over to Williams might help them. The way he's managed to turn HRT around from absolute peril to beating Virgin in a year must prove one thing at least, he's good at managing teams short on cash and turning them around, and trust me, Williams really need some better management. This could mean the return of Williams to the front of the grid

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 30 Jun 2011, 09:39

Peter wrote:
mediocre wrote:According to this (German), Kolles might go to Williams. And then...R.I.P. Williams F1 Team.

I doubt that Williams would die, on the contrary, Kolles jumping over to Williams might help them. The way he's managed to turn HRT around from absolute peril to beating Virgin in a year must prove one thing at least, he's good at managing teams short on cash and turning them around, and trust me, Williams really need some better management. This could mean the return of Williams to the front of the grid

It would be a massive surprise if Kolles turned out to be a successful team manager. Many on this forum would have to eat humble pie, including me...

(remember the "Go home Collin Kolles campaign?)

Sauber010 · Post by **Sauber010** » 30 Jun 2011, 10:47

Speedcafe, Australian Journalist wrote: Australian Daniel Ricciardo will make his Formula One debut in the next round of the world championship at Silverstone for the British Grand Prix.
The West Australian will drive for HRT F1 Team, replacing Indian driver Narain Karthikeyan.

Sorry, what?
Looks like he'll be on loan from Red Bull. Where did that come from?!

http://www.speedcafe.com/2011/06/30/dan ... lverstone/

the Masked Lapwing · Post by **the Masked Lapwing** » 30 Jun 2011, 10:53

Sauber010 wrote:
Speedcafe, Australian Journalist wrote: Australian Daniel Ricciardo will make his Formula One debut in the next round of the world championship at Silverstone for the British Grand Prix.
The West Australian will drive for HRT F1 Team, replacing Indian driver Narain Karthikeyan.

Sorry, what?
Looks like he'll be on loan from Red Bull. Where did that come from?!

http://www.speedcafe.com/2011/06/30/dan ... lverstone/

But then, this is from the same website that came up with "Antonio Luizzi".

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 30 Jun 2011, 11:02

the Masked Lapwing wrote:
Sauber010 wrote:
Speedcafe, Australian Journalist wrote: Australian Daniel Ricciardo will make his Formula One debut in the next round of the world championship at Silverstone for the British Grand Prix.
The West Australian will drive for HRT F1 Team, replacing Indian driver Narain Karthikeyan.

Sorry, what?
Looks like he'll be on loan from Red Bull. Where did that come from?!

http://www.speedcafe.com/2011/06/30/dan ... lverstone/

But then, this is from the same website that came up with "Antonio Luizzi".

I can't find that report elsewhere... Which makes me doubt its veracity.

Captain Hammer · Post by **Captain Hammer** » 30 Jun 2011, 11:27

PerthNow are also reporting it. Both PerthNow and Speedcafe agree that an annoucement will be made later tonight.

As for "Antonio Liuzzi" it's easy to see how that might have come up. Liuzzi's first name is usually given as Tonio, which is similar to Tony and Tony is the short form of Anthony.

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 30 Jun 2011, 11:37

Captain Hammer wrote:PerthNow are also reporting it. Both PerthNow and Speedcafe agree that an annoucement will be made later tonight.

As for "Antonio Liuzzi" it's easy to see how that might have come up. Liuzzi's first name is usually given as Tonio, which is similar to Tony and Tony is the short form of Anthony.

Planet F1 are reporting it as a rumour. Anyway, if true, that puts both current Toro Rosso drivers in a prime position to complete the season. And my avatar bet will be safer! 8-)

Unless Ricciardo shines in an HRT and 'Lucky' Tost shoots one of its drivers as quickly as it happens.

Sauber010 · Post by **Sauber010** » 30 Jun 2011, 11:38

Captain Hammer wrote:PerthNow are also reporting it. Both PerthNow and Speedcafe agree that an annoucement will be made later tonight.

As for "Antonio Liuzzi" it's easy to see how that might have come up. Liuzzi's first name is usually given as Tonio, which is similar to Tony and Tony is the short form of Anthony.

Beat me to it. From my experience Speedcafe have been quite a reliable source.
It does seem strange though, although Kolles does like his 'revolving doors'.

Jeroen Krautmeir · Post by **Jeroen Krautmeir** » 30 Jun 2011, 11:39

But hang on, that doesn't make sense, does it? Why dump Karthikeyan when he's bringing all the cash? Surely, if anybody, it should be Tonio who's getting the boot, considering he's on empty pockets, and I'm assuming if this rumour is true, then Ricciardo should be bringing some RB cash to compliment Narain's millions.

Post by **tommykl** » 30 Jun 2011, 11:39

Captain Hammer wrote:PerthNow are also reporting it. Both PerthNow and Speedcafe agree that an annoucement will be made later tonight.

As for "Antonio Liuzzi" it's easy to see how that might have come up. Liuzzi's first name is usually given as Tonio, which is similar to Tony and Tony is the short form of Anthony.

The Antonio may be forgivable, but they wrote multiple times that his surname was "Luizzi" :roll:

Post by **mario** » 30 Jun 2011, 11:55

Klon wrote:
mediocre wrote:According to this (German), Kolles might go to Williams. And then...R.I.P. Williams F1 Team.

Yeah. Luckily this site can be considered quite a sucky source.

Kolles himself has rubbished any suggestion that he would be going to Williams quite forcefully when the question was put to him - besides, Williams have been busy recruiting from elsewhere within the paddock.
One of the new recruits was Jason Somerville, who had originally worked for Williams's aerodynamics department (firstly, for BMW's Le Mans program, followed by the F1 team) until 2003, then went to Toyota, followed by Renault in 2009 where he spearheaded development of the R31 (which, incidentally, marks him out as yet another senior designer who had walked out of Renault in recent months). Meanwhile, Mark Gillan has also returned to Williams from stints at Red Bull and Toyota, where he worked as their Head Aerodynamicist, and he is becoming the new Chief Operations Engineer. http://www.f1technical.net/news/16438

So, that would suggest that even if Kolles wanted to leave HRT, Williams seem to have filled most of their senior posts, and at the moment few other teams look like they want to replace their senior management at the moment. That said, Kolles may leave the team of his own accord - it is rumoured that he is not on good terms with the Carabantes family.

Sauber010 wrote:
Speedcafe, Australian Journalist wrote: Australian Daniel Ricciardo will make his Formula One debut in the next round of the world championship at Silverstone for the British Grand Prix.
The West Australian will drive for HRT F1 Team, replacing Indian driver Narain Karthikeyan.

Sorry, what?
Looks like he'll be on loan from Red Bull. Where did that come from?!

http://www.speedcafe.com/2011/06/30/dan ... lverstone/

For now, I'll share your surprise at that announcement. If Ricciardo was to replace anybody right now, I'd have thought that it would be one of the Toro Rosso drivers - probably Alguersuari, given his poor qualifying record and the fact that Buemi had been the more consistent driver of the two (though Alguersuari's points finish in Valencia should have reduced the pressure somewhat).

That said, why would the team want to get rid of Karthikeyan?

Sure, his pace hasn't been great - though considering how long it has been since he last drove in F1, he has probably performed better than expected, and at times he has still kept Liuzzi honest. Moreover, there is that sponsorship deal with Tata - I'd imagine that is conditional on Narain being given a drive - so any deal would probably require Ricciardo to be bringing in enough money to pay Karthikeyan and his sponsors off for cutting the contract short.

David AGS · Post by **David AGS** » 30 Jun 2011, 12:23

As said before, it makes sence for Red Bull.

This kid is highly rated, so if Red Bull want to back him as a future star, put him in now and lets see how he goes. Red Bull have got massive wallets which will come in handy at HRT.

But surely theres got to be something up with Karthikeyan. Remember Silverstone was either Senna's 'break race'.
Mabe Tata have had enough of funding the team? Who knows.

Karthikeyan might still do Friday sessions though. At least he will race in the India if this is all true.

It has made the HRT forum side a little interesting though which is good, and would be the first time in a long long time that two drivers from Down Under will be on the grid if this is all correct!

Peter · Post by **Peter** » 30 Jun 2011, 12:54

Jeroen Krautmeir wrote:But hang on, that doesn't make sense, does it? Why dump Karthikeyan when he's bringing all the cash? Surely, if anybody, it should be Tonio who's getting the boot, considering he's on empty pockets, and I'm assuming if this rumour is true, then Ricciardo should be bringing some RB cash to compliment Narain's millions.

Liuzzi is no.1 in that team, being the faster driver at HRT, with good experience to follow up. Karthikeyan has some experience, and the money as well, but HRT is on more steady ground now, so don't need the cash as desperately as they used to. Though I don't agree with replacing old experienced, consistent, stay-out-of-trouble Narain with a noob who might run up HRT's repair bills. Plus, will he be faster anyway?

I find that Riccardo is one of the most overhyped drivers i've heard of. RB and STR are talking about putting him in race seats, as if he's an F1 God, when all he did was beat Vettel's pole time in the young driver tests last year, and have some good results in F. Renault.

coloni_subaru · Post by **coloni_subaru** » 30 Jun 2011, 14:02

[/quote]I find that Riccardo is one of the most overhyped drivers i've heard of. RB and STR are talking about putting him in race seats, as if he's an F1 God, when all he did was beat Vettel's pole time in the young driver tests last year, and have some good results in F. Renault.[/quote]

Actually Ricciardo dominated British F3 in 2009, the year after he won Formula Renault, also comfortably. In testing he was regularly quicker than his established team mates, and shone in the wet (i was there in Barcelona watching when he did so). This year he is 4th in Formula Renault despite missing the first round and doubling up with F1 commitments (where he usually goes faster than the other Toro Rosso). And as for beating Vettel's pole time in the young driver's test, its more than anyone else except Webber has managed in quali this year!

And don't forget, Alguersuari was pushed into the seat mid season after 'only' winning the British F3 championship..

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 30 Jun 2011, 14:24

coloni_subaru wrote:Actually Ricciardo dominated British F3 in 2009, the year after he won Formula Renault, also comfortably. In testing he was regularly quicker than his established team mates, and shone in the wet (i was there in Barcelona watching when he did so). This year he is 4th in Formula Renault despite missing the first round and doubling up with F1 commitments (where he usually goes faster than the other Toro Rosso). And as for beating Vettel's pole time in the young driver's test, its more than anyone else except Webber has managed in quali this year!

And don't forget, Alguersuari was pushed into the seat mid season after 'only' winning the British F3 championship..

Now let's see... Ricciardo is 1-3 against Buemi and 2-2 against Alguersuari in FP1s. I know he does not knows the car the way Buemi or Alguersuari know and that he showed himself already and more or less on par with the both STR drivers. But this is not regularly going faster than the other Toro Rosso. Also we don't know how different the car was at the young driver's test. Some cars were already interim cars.

EDIT: It is now official. Ricciardo to drive for HRT except at the Indian GP.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/92735

Mister Fungus · Post by **Mister Fungus** » 30 Jun 2011, 15:07

I wonder how well he'll fare against Liuzzi, this is good news for HRT though. Sorta kinda.

GwilymJJames · Post by **GwilymJJames** » 30 Jun 2011, 17:14

Hispania wrote:Hispania Racing and Red Bull Racing signed a collaboration deal today which allows young Australian talent Daniel Ricciardo to join the Spanish team as its official driver.

The current Formula 1 World Champion team has shown trust in Hispania Racing’s project and has chosen José Ramón Carabante’s team as a support for the formation and development of its driver.

Australian driver Daniel Ricciardo, who was behind the steering-wheel in every first practice session of the eight grand prix up to now, will finally see his dream come true and become a Formula 1 race-driver starting from next week’s British Grand Prix.

Daniel Ricciardo joins Narain Karthikeyan and Vitantonio Liuzzi as official drivers of the Spanish Formula 1 team, Hispania Racing.

José Ramón Carabante, Chairman of Hispania Racing: “This agreement is a reward for all the hard work Hispania Racing has shown since we started in Formula 1 last year. We’re proud that the Formula 1 World Champion team has trusted us in their effort of developing their drivers. Let’s hope that this is just the start of a fruitful relationship”.

Colin Kolles, Hispania Racing Team Principal: “I’m happy to welcome Daniel to the team; I’m glad the Team managed to conclude this deal together with Dr. Helmut Marko who deserves my personal respect".

Daniel Ricciardo: “It’s a dream come true for me – for the first time on an F1 starting grid! I had to pinch myself a couple of times to be sure that it’s real. I’m excited and can hardly wait to drive at Silverstone. It’s a new challenge, a new experience, a new team, but I’m ready and will give of my best in any event".

DANIEL RICCIARDO
Born on the 1st of July of 1989 in Perth, Australia.
In 2008 he won his first title as a driver when he claimed the Formula Renault 2.0 Western European Cup. In 2009 he moved on to British Formula Three, driving for British outfit Carlin Motorsport. He would win this championship by 87 points.
From there he went to Formula Renault 3.5 where he raced for Tech 1. In the 2010 championship he finished only two points off the title which was won by Russian driver, Mikhail Aleshin.
In 2011, after testing for Red Bull Racing at the young drivers tests in Abu Dhabi, he was named as third driver for Scuderia Toro Rosso.

http://www.hispaniaracing.com/news.php?nid=401

Interestingly, no confirmation if Ricciardo is going to be replacing Karthikeyan or Liuzzi.

S951 · Post by **S951** » 30 Jun 2011, 17:18

https://www.facebook.com/hispaniaracing

now this is going to be interesting to see how danny does, I know he's good chances are he will out qualify tonio looking forward to free practice

solarcold · Post by **solarcold** » 30 Jun 2011, 17:24

No. You won't replace Tonio. You won't fire Liuzzi. Won't. Never. No way. Oh god, promise me. Please. I want to sleep calmly this night.

Peter · Post by **Peter** » 30 Jun 2011, 17:28

DanielPT wrote:
coloni_subaru wrote:Actually Ricciardo dominated British F3 in 2009, the year after he won Formula Renault, also comfortably. In testing he was regularly quicker than his established team mates, and shone in the wet (i was there in Barcelona watching when he did so). This year he is 4th in Formula Renault despite missing the first round and doubling up with F1 commitments (where he usually goes faster than the other Toro Rosso). And as for beating Vettel's pole time in the young driver's test, its more than anyone else except Webber has managed in quali this year!

And don't forget, Alguersuari was pushed into the seat mid season after 'only' winning the British F3 championship..

Now let's see... Ricciardo is 1-3 against Buemi and 2-2 against Alguersuari in FP1s. I know he does not knows the car the way Buemi or Alguersuari know and that he showed himself already and more or less on par with the both STR drivers. But this is not regularly going faster than the other Toro Rosso. Also we don't know how different the car was at the young driver's test. Some cars were already interim cars.

EDIT: It is now official. Ricciardo to drive for HRT except at the Indian GP.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/92735

To me, what made the fact that he lapped faster than Vettel not so interesting was the conditions under which he'd have done that. It'd have been midday, when it was hot, plus it was after the track was well rubbered in after an entire race weekend. Those things combined would make a huge difference in grip levels. The track also would've been clear of dust, sand and marbles because of the weekends racing.

And, wait. He's repalcing Liuzzi? OMGWTFBBQ NOOOOOOOOOOO

patrick · Post by **patrick** » 30 Jun 2011, 17:30

I knew the driver switching would start around silverstone, but this is interesting for Ricciardo as I bet he thought he'd end up in a STR, not a HRT :lol:

This is a pain for me though because the Guardian's season guide results page has no space for extra drivers like it did last year. bah

Mister Fungus · Post by **Mister Fungus** » 30 Jun 2011, 17:31

Karthikeyan, according to Autosport.

solarcold · Post by **solarcold** » 30 Jun 2011, 17:32

Peter wrote:And, wait. He's repalcing Liuzzi?

it is not officially published who exactly will be replaced.

HRT official site wrote:Daniel Ricciardo joins Narain Karthikeyan and Vitantonio Liuzzi as official drivers of the Spanish Formula 1 team, Hispania Racing.

shinji · Post by **shinji** » 30 Jun 2011, 17:33

So now Red Bull in effect have a front-running team, a midfield team, and a backmarker team. It's only a matter of time before they own the sport itself.

In fact, with all the football teams they own, and their support of various other things like the Flugtag, it may indeed be a matter of time before they own 'sport'.

Peter · Post by **Peter** » 30 Jun 2011, 17:35

shinji wrote:So now Red Bull in effect have a front-running team, a midfield team, and a backmarker team. It's only a matter of time before they own the sport itself.

In fact, with all the football teams they own, and their support of various other things like the Flugtag, it may indeed be a matter of time before they own 'sport'.

Red Bull is just paying HRT to put Daniel in the car to see how he can do. HRT is just saying that they hope that it may lead to more partnerships between the 2.

S951 · Post by **S951** » 30 Jun 2011, 17:43

AUTOSPORT understands that Ricciardo will take Narain Karthikeyan's seat alongside Tonio Liuzzi for all remaining 2011 races bar the Indian Grand Prix, with Karthikeyan still set to run at his home race

looks like they are looking upwards and onwards somewhat if they can afford to do this

Khausen Effect · Post by **Khausen Effect** » 30 Jun 2011, 17:44

Peter wrote:Red Bull is just paying HRT to put Daniel in the car to see how he can do.

It seems that Red Bull don't have enough cars for all their drivers. Maybe they should buy HRT to run Ricciardo and maybe Vergne.

golic_2004 · Post by **golic_2004** » 30 Jun 2011, 18:01

S951 wrote:
AUTOSPORT understands that Ricciardo will take Narain Karthikeyan's seat alongside Tonio Liuzzi for all remaining 2011 races bar the Indian Grand Prix, with Karthikeyan still set to run at his home race

looks like they are looking upwards and onwards somewhat if they can afford to do this

So does this mean I can take Karthikeyan back to the United States to try nascar again? :lol:

Klon · Post by **Klon** » 30 Jun 2011, 18:06

Why do you replace Karthikeyan and not Mr. Bland himself Vitantonio Liuzzi? Life is just not fun anymore.