Sauber F1 Team - Financial struggles

Zetec · Post by **Zetec** » 08 Jul 2013, 07:38

So yesterday Peter Sauber was interviewed on Swiss-TV. An interview, which gives a good view over the current struggles of Sauber F1 Team:

1. They are running out of money. Right now they are living from day to day.
2. Some supplieres have to wait a little longer to have their bills paid, but they seem to fully unterstand the situation and are still supplying the team.
3. All salaries are still being payed on-date. Claims, that Hülkenberg is waiting for money, are not true.
4. Hülkenberg did resign his contract. So he has no contract at Sauber right now for 2014.
5. Sauber has a solution to make the car quicker. But, they don't have to money right now to produce the updates!
6. They are talking to some investors and sponsors and hope to have a solution until the end of the month.
7. Their current sponsors have given them some more money last month to help them out.
8. They have a Plan "B": Selling the team if necessary.

Alextrax52 · Post by **Alextrax52** » 08 Jul 2013, 08:00

Crash.net have some rumors that there's some Russian Investors wanting to take over Sauber.

http://www.crash.net/f1/news/193284/1/r ... auber.html

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 08 Jul 2013, 08:06

Serves them right for ditching Kobayashi.

Shizuka · Post by **Shizuka** » 08 Jul 2013, 08:11

The last time a Russian bought out a team sold it a year later.
Yes, I'm talking about Alex Shnaider.
If there is serious will to help the Sauber team, it better be a longer investment.

wsrgo · Post by **wsrgo** » 08 Jul 2013, 09:23

Kimi-ICE wrote:Crash.net have some rumors that there's some Russian Investors wanting to take over Sauber.

http://www.crash.net/f1/news/193284/1/r ... auber.html

If it is indeed a Todt-SMP collaboration, then possible drivers next year:
Nicolas Todt/ART: Jules Bianchi/Pastor Maldonado/James Calado/ er...Felipe Massa :?:

SMP: Vitaly Petrov/Mikhail Aleshin/Daniil Move

Dan B · Post by **Dan B** » 08 Jul 2013, 12:59

Shizuka wrote:The last time a Russian bought out a team sold it a year later.
Yes, I'm talking about Alex Shnaider.
If there is serious will to help the Sauber team, it better be a longer investment.

To be fair, Jordan was near backmarker status when they bought it, and it took someone else altogether to properly haul that team back into the points.

Sauber, while not doing great this year, had 4 podiums last year, so they might be better off. Who knows, though, what they will do this year with the car being a piece of crap.

Aerospeed · Post by **Aerospeed** » 08 Jul 2013, 13:06

I'd like to see a video or link to this interview, this sounds really interesting...

Backmarker · Post by **Backmarker** » 08 Jul 2013, 13:07

Shizuka wrote:The last time a Russian bought out a team sold it a year later.

What the hell is Nikolay Fomenko then, if not a Russian?

Shizuka · Post by **Shizuka** » 08 Jul 2013, 13:08

Backmarker wrote:
Shizuka wrote:The last time a Russian bought out a team sold it a year later.

What the hell is Nikolay Fomenko then, if not a Russian?

Apologies - totally forgot about Fomenko and his involvement with Marussia.

Zetec · Post by **Zetec** » 08 Jul 2013, 18:58

JeremyMcClean wrote:I'd like to see a video or link to this interview, this sounds really interesting...

Here you go: http://www.srf.ch/sport/motorsport/form ... -luft-mehr

nigellamansell · Post by **nigellamansell** » 09 Jul 2013, 01:12

I can't wait for the new owners to be announced as the Shannon Group

LionZoo · Post by **LionZoo** » 09 Jul 2013, 01:13

CoopsII wrote:Serves them right for ditching Kobayashi.

My thoughts exactly.

UncreativeUsername37 · Post by **UncreativeUsername37** » 09 Jul 2013, 01:31

LionZoo wrote:
CoopsII wrote:Serves them right for ditching Kobayashi.

My thoughts exactly.

I'd ditch Kobayashi for Hülkenberg....

shinji · Post by **shinji** » 09 Jul 2013, 01:36

UgncreativeUsergname wrote:
LionZoo wrote:
CoopsII wrote:Serves them right for ditching Kobayashi.

My thoughts exactly.

I'd ditch Kobayashi for Hülkenberg....

2012 Kobayashi, perhaps you're right. 2010 Kobayashi, however, would be a whole other kettle of fish.

go_Rubens · Post by **go_Rubens** » 09 Jul 2013, 02:20

I am one who does not like to see a team like Sauber, who have survived since 1993, in trouble. I like to cheer on the smaller teams, and this is one of them. I don't like seeing this.

It's the same with Williams with a few struggling drivers who can't use the car they way they want.

UncreativeUsername37 · Post by **UncreativeUsername37** » 09 Jul 2013, 02:58

go_Rubens wrote:I am one who does not like to see a team like Sauber, who have survived since 1993, in trouble. I like to cheer on the smaller teams, and this is one of them. I don't like seeing this.

It's the same with Williams with a few struggling drivers who can't use the car they way they want.

It pains me to see the smaller teams in trouble.

Do you dislike seeing small teams in trouble? I'm not sure.

go_Rubens · Post by **go_Rubens** » 09 Jul 2013, 03:04

UgncreativeUsergname wrote:
go_Rubens wrote:I am one who does not like to see a team like Sauber, who have survived since 1993, in trouble. I like to cheer on the smaller teams, and this is one of them. I don't like seeing this.

It's the same with Williams with a few struggling drivers who can't use the car they way they want.

It pains me to see the smaller teams in trouble.

Do you dislike seeing small teams in trouble? I'm not sure.

Yes. I'll edit that.

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 09 Jul 2013, 07:05

shinji wrote:2012 Kobayashi, perhaps you're right. 2010 Kobayashi, however, would be a whole other kettle of fish.

I didnt know it was possible to have that option

Mercedes firked up then, they should've signed up the 1995 Schumacher.

LellaLombardi · Post by **LellaLombardi** » 09 Jul 2013, 12:25

I too find it sad to see Sauber struggling like this, what is more sad is how badly they have dropped in the past year. It seems unbelievable that only last year they had four podiums, and one of the nattiest cars and driver line-ups on the grid. I like to see privateer teams doing well and I really admired how Peter Sauber came out of retirement to save the team. I think that Hulkenberg is right to be looking for a way out though, he needs to get off the sinking ship to protect his own interests.

I wonder how things would be looking if Schumi had stayed another year and driven for them for expenses only, as was rumoured?

Post by **mario** » 09 Jul 2013, 16:05

LellaLombardi wrote:I too find it sad to see Sauber struggling like this, what is more sad is how badly they have dropped in the past year. It seems unbelievable that only last year they had four podiums, and one of the nattiest cars and driver line-ups on the grid. I like to see privateer teams doing well and I really admired how Peter Sauber came out of retirement to save the team. I think that Hulkenberg is right to be looking for a way out though, he needs to get off the sinking ship to protect his own interests.

I wonder how things would be looking if Schumi had stayed another year and driven for them for expenses only, as was rumoured?

The fact that Sauber are in such financial difficulty would go a long way towards explaining why they have slid backwards since their peak in 2012 - if they are in a situation where they are unable to develop the car significantly over the course of the season, then, with most of the other teams doing at least some development work (even if most teams are putting more effort into 2014 rather than 2013), their relative pace is going to suffer.

As for the speculation over a Schumacher deal (I hadn't heard about that suggestion), well, on the one hand his presence might have helped draw in some additional sponsorship, but, if it is the case that the drivers are being held back that much by the car, then it is hard to see what difference he or any other driver would make in terms of results.

Zetec · Post by **Zetec** » 11 Jul 2013, 12:01

It's now a fact, that Sauber is confronted with its first enforcements (in Switzerland you can legaly ask at the municipal administration, if a company or a person has any enforcements, so I can confirm it. Different bills have not been paid, the highest being about a million swiss francs, and a lot of bills around 10'000.-).

So, in Switzerland, if you have any enforcements, you have to find some money pretty fast to pay your creditors or bankruptcy is knocking at the door faster than they would like.

Post by **mario** » 11 Jul 2013, 18:25

Zetec wrote:It's now a fact, that Sauber is confronted with its first enforcements (in Switzerland you can legaly ask at the municipal administration, if a company or a person has any enforcements, so I can confirm it. Different bills have not been paid, the highest being about a million swiss francs, and a lot of bills around 10'000.-).

So, in Switzerland, if you have any enforcements, you have to find some money pretty fast to pay your creditors or bankruptcy is knocking at the door faster than they would like.

Those are not exactly small bills (the smaller ones are about £7000, with the largest equating to about £700,000), and I can imagine that being compelled to pay them through legal action would cause considerable cash flow problems at the best of times (and these are not the best of times for Sauber by the sounds of things). Even if there is the possibility of a longer term rescue package being put together, it might be too late if the team is choked by cash flow problems in the short term...

Klon · Post by **Klon** » 12 Jul 2013, 01:23

Well, that could get Hülkenberg out of Sauber even faster. They need a pay-driver now. A rich one that is.

roblo97 · Post by **roblo97** » 12 Jul 2013, 06:35

That is kinda annoying for me since my second (I think) cousin Nick works for them but if worse comes to worse, he can always rejoin redbull again since he was there 2010-2011

Zetec · Post by **Zetec** » 12 Jul 2013, 07:24

What annoys me the most, and also most people here in Switzerland is the question: Where the hell is Monisha Kaltenborn? Since the problems got public, nobody has seen her or heard something from her.
It's always poor Peter Sauber, who has to face the media.

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 12 Jul 2013, 08:16

roblomas52 wrote:That is kinda annoying for me since my second (I think) cousin Nick works for them but if worse comes to worse, he can always rejoin redbull again since he was there 2010-2011

Ooh, do you get F1 themed gear for Christmas presents? Via Santa obviously, because I know plenty of members are of the younger persuasion.

andrew2209 · Post by **andrew2209** » 12 Jul 2013, 09:19

Klon wrote:Well, that could get Hülkenberg out of Sauber even faster. They need a pay-driver now. A rich one that is.

Does Kobayashi still have those fan donations?

Zetec · Post by **Zetec** » 12 Jul 2013, 11:25

andrew2209 wrote:
Klon wrote:Well, that could get Hülkenberg out of Sauber even faster. They need a pay-driver now. A rich one that is.

Does Kobayashi still have those fan donations?

Yes, and he said, that he will keep it to find a F1 seat and won't use it otherwise.
He could try to get his Sauber seat back. But, as far as I remember the donation wouldn't be enough for Sauber to pay all the bills.
More likely they need a driver like Karthikeyan or Senna, who bring a few millions.
But, on the other hand, Hulkenberg has a contract, and I think he will stick to it. Being away for half a season would be enough, to be out of the minds of the teams for 2014.

AdrianSutil · Post by **AdrianSutil** » 12 Jul 2013, 11:46

Zetec wrote:
andrew2209 wrote:
Klon wrote:Well, that could get Hülkenberg out of Sauber even faster. They need a pay-driver now. A rich one that is.

Does Kobayashi still have those fan donations?

Yes, and he said, that he will keep it to find a F1 seat and won't use it otherwise.
He could try to get his Sauber seat back. But, as far as I remember the donation wouldn't be enough for Sauber to pay all the bills.
More likely they need a driver like Karthikeyan or Senna, who bring a few millions.
But, on the other hand, Hulkenberg has a contract, and I think he will stick to it. Being away for half a season would be enough, to be out of the minds of the teams for 2014.

It could work in Hulkenberg's favour. Struggling midfield team who can't pay their bills have a driver who can scrape a point here and there. Teams will look at that as a positive thing and might take him on next year. I'm looking at Lotus if Raikkonen goes to RedBull.

Post by **mario** » 12 Jul 2013, 12:35

Zetec wrote:What annoys me the most, and also most people here in Switzerland is the question: Where the hell is Monisha Kaltenborn? Since the problems got public, nobody has seen her or heard something from her.
It's always poor Peter Sauber, who has to face the media.

Kaltenborn has occasionally spoken to the media, but mainly English speaking organisations like Autosport rather than the Swiss press.

roblo97 · Post by **roblo97** » 12 Jul 2013, 12:57

CoopsII wrote:
roblomas52 wrote:That is kinda annoying for me since my second (I think) cousin Nick works for them but if worse comes to worse, he can always rejoin redbull again since he was there 2010-2011

Ooh, do you get F1 themed gear for Christmas presents? Via Santa obviously, because I know plenty of members are of the younger persuasion.

Um… no not really. Last time I got some stuff from him was some Red Bull posters in September 2010

go_Rubens · Post by **go_Rubens** » 12 Jul 2013, 14:10

roblomas52 wrote:
CoopsII wrote:
roblomas52 wrote:That is kinda annoying for me since my second (I think) cousin Nick works for them but if worse comes to worse, he can always rejoin redbull again since he was there 2010-2011

Ooh, do you get F1 themed gear for Christmas presents? Via Santa obviously, because I know plenty of members are of the younger persuasion.

Um… no not really. Last time I got some stuff from him was some Red Bull posters in September 2010

Well, I've gotten Ferrari fan gear for my birthday and I'm happy with that

roblo97 · Post by **roblo97** » 12 Jul 2013, 14:20

I sleep in what used to be the attic so the only place the posters would fit is on the 2 sloping walls but the blue tak doesn't work on there

S951 · Post by **S951** » 12 Jul 2013, 15:09

reading into the thread on autosport all sorts of bad things are coming out now, thought they would of been ok with a 2nd year of slimm money but then again it's not his boy checo. Read something about them needing 30 million to finish off the season true or not I don't know I doubt the hulk would walk but if he did get replaced there only a handful of drivers with cash I know that would jump at it bad thing really as hulk in last few races showing some good pace

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 12 Jul 2013, 15:31

roblomas52 wrote:I sleep in what used to be the attic so the only place the posters would fit is on the 2 sloping walls but the blue tak doesn't work on there

The people downstairs know you're there though right? Has anyone here watched The Grudge....?

roblo97 · Post by **roblo97** » 12 Jul 2013, 17:37

CoopsII wrote:
roblomas52 wrote:I sleep in what used to be the attic so the only place the posters would fit is on the 2 sloping walls but the blue tak doesn't work on there

The people downstairs know you're there though right? Has anyone here watched The Grudge....?

Yeah mum and dad know I still live with them

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 13 Jul 2013, 10:41

nigellamansell wrote:I can't wait for the new owners to be announced as the Shannon Group

I was thinking perhaps Zoran Stefanovic. Or even, heaven forbid, Don Pentecost!!!

Svenko Wankerov · Post by **Svenko Wankerov** » 13 Jul 2013, 11:12

dr-baker wrote:
nigellamansell wrote:I can't wait for the new owners to be announced as the Shannon Group

I was thinking perhaps Zoran Stefanovic. Or even, heaven forbid, Don Pentecost!!!

Time for Qadbak to try again!

sswishbone · Post by **sswishbone** » 13 Jul 2013, 16:45

I can't wait for Stefan GP to finally grace the grid! :twisted:

FullMetalJack · Post by **FullMetalJack** » 13 Jul 2013, 18:24

Svenko Wankerov wrote:
dr-baker wrote:
nigellamansell wrote:I can't wait for the new owners to be announced as the Shannon Group

I was thinking perhaps Zoran Stefanovic. Or even, heaven forbid, Don Pentecost!!!

Time for Qadbak to try again!

Maybe FIRST can finally properly enter a Grand Prix