Ponderbox

[roblo97]

At this point, I think it would have been better for Sauber if they had Van der Garde instead of Gutierrez. It seems like he has been more impressive with the same amount of brain fade.

But how much sponsorship money would he have brought? Sauber obviously hired Gutierrez because of the Mexican money he bought, so if they took GVDG onboard they would have arguably better talent but not as much money, which as we know is crucial to their survival at the moment.

Or the best of both worlds, Vitaly Petrov

[Zetec]

At this point, I think it would have been better for Sauber if they had Van der Garde instead of Gutierrez. It seems like he has been more impressive with the same amount of brain fade.

But how much sponsorship money would he have brought? Sauber obviously hired Gutierrez because of the Mexican money he bought, so if they took GVDG onboard they would have arguably better talent but not as much money, which as we know is crucial to their survival at the moment.

By the repeating words of Sauber: "Gutierrez is not a paydriver!" This is what Sauber is telling to the swiss-media in every interview they give. And as we know, GVDG brings much more money than Pic, so it seems to be quite a lot of money if you look at the package of Pic's sponsorship.

[mario]

At this point, I think it would have been better for Sauber if they had Van der Garde instead of Gutierrez. It seems like he has been more impressive with the same amount of brain fade.

But how much sponsorship money would he have brought? Sauber obviously hired Gutierrez because of the Mexican money he bought, so if they took GVDG onboard they would have arguably better talent but not as much money, which as we know is crucial to their survival at the moment.

By the repeating words of Sauber: "Gutierrez is not a paydriver!" This is what Sauber is telling to the swiss-media in every interview they give. And as we know, GVDG brings much more money than Pic, so it seems to be quite a lot of money if you look at the package of Pic's sponsorship.

Sauber might say that Gutierrez is not a pay driver, but the fact that two of Sauber's primary sponsors are Claro and Telcel, both of which are associated with the Slim family (who are backers of Gutierrez) would speak against that.

That said, I do wonder what van der Garde brings to the team in terms of sponsorship - McGregor are, I believe, associated with van der Garde, and I would presume that Beelen, a Dutch specialist demolition company, would also be associated with van der Garde. Are there any other sponsors of Caterham associated with van der Garde?

[good_Ralf]

That said, I do wonder what van der Garde brings to the team in terms of sponsorship - McGregor are, I believe, associated with van der Garde, and I would presume that Beelen, a Dutch specialist demolition company, would also be associated with van der Garde. Are there any other sponsors of Caterham associated with van der Garde?

Airbus? They weren't sponsors of Caterham last year. In fact, it was Air Asia last year. Then again, that might be Pic's sponsor. EAD looks like another new one as well.

[roblo97]

That said, I do wonder what van der Garde brings to the team in terms of sponsorship - McGregor are, I believe, associated with van der Garde, and I would presume that Beelen, a Dutch specialist demolition company, would also be associated with van der Garde. Are there any other sponsors of Caterham associated with van der Garde?

Airbus? They weren't sponsors of Caterham last year. In fact, it was Air Asia last year. Then again, that might be Pic's sponsor. EAD looks like another new one as well.

Airbus was actually a sponsor as they had a 2010 F1 car at the Farnbrough air show and I know that because I was there

[pasta_maldonado]

That said, I do wonder what van der Garde brings to the team in terms of sponsorship - McGregor are, I believe, associated with van der Garde, and I would presume that Beelen, a Dutch specialist demolition company, would also be associated with van der Garde. Are there any other sponsors of Caterham associated with van der Garde?

Airbus? They weren't sponsors of Caterham last year. In fact, it was Air Asia last year. Then again, that might be Pic's sponsor. EAD looks like another new one as well.

Airbus was actually a sponsor as they had a 2010 F1 car at the Farnbrough air show and I know that because I was there

They put current liveries on older cars. That might have been what happened

[Ataxia]

That said, I do wonder what van der Garde brings to the team in terms of sponsorship - McGregor are, I believe, associated with van der Garde, and I would presume that Beelen, a Dutch specialist demolition company, would also be associated with van der Garde. Are there any other sponsors of Caterham associated with van der Garde?

Airbus? They weren't sponsors of Caterham last year. In fact, it was Air Asia last year. Then again, that might be Pic's sponsor. EAD looks like another new one as well.

Yeah, although Caterham have a technical tie-up with Airbus I think Charles Pic has Lagardere backing...which I believe is affiliated in someway with Airbus (hence Safran?). Regardless, Airbus did make an appearance on the CT01 last season.

I know Van der Garde brought VoiceCash as well to his GP2 teams, but I don't think that's made an appearance this season.

[kevinbotz]

That said, I do wonder what van der Garde brings to the team in terms of sponsorship - McGregor are, I believe, associated with van der Garde, and I would presume that Beelen, a Dutch specialist demolition company, would also be associated with van der Garde. Are there any other sponsors of Caterham associated with van der Garde?

I took a glance at van der Garde's website, where it also lists Regus, a multinational providing serviced office accommodations, and Maasfactor, which is apparently a Dutch advertising agency, as his personal sponsors.

[dr-baker]

F1 is cited as a generally safe sport nowadays, but it is very sexist. Since the last female attempted to qualify for a race, there has been 2 driver deaths and 3 marshall deaths. And it has been over 21 years now, since Giovanna Amati was replace by a future World Champion....

[kevinbotz]

F1 is cited as a generally safe sport nowadays, but it is very sexist. Since the last female attempted to qualify for a race, there has been 2 driver deaths and 3 marshall deaths. And it has been over 21 years now, since Giovanna Amati was replace by a future World Champion....

I think it has less to do with Formula One specifically than the prejudice near the bottom of the ladder, which severely curtails the development of female talent through the feeder series. As far as I know, there's only one female driver in GP3 right now, and her performances have been underwhelming, to be diplomatic.

Obviously, there are female drivers with far more talent than the aforementioned GP3 pilot, but the problem rests in that they either can't raise enough sponsorship for a F3 seat or a seat in a similar entry-level racing series. With the exception of a very few, most female pilots in motorsport today are relatively mediocre drivers backed by a healthy sum of cash.

[apple2009]

Alice Powell is worthy of a mention.

[Alextrax52]

Alice Powell is worthy of a mention.

True if anyone bothers to give her a chance. After all she is a Champion in the Minor British Classes

[mario]

That said, I do wonder what van der Garde brings to the team in terms of sponsorship - McGregor are, I believe, associated with van der Garde, and I would presume that Beelen, a Dutch specialist demolition company, would also be associated with van der Garde. Are there any other sponsors of Caterham associated with van der Garde?

Airbus? They weren't sponsors of Caterham last year. In fact, it was Air Asia last year. Then again, that might be Pic's sponsor. EAD looks like another new one as well.

Yeah, although Caterham have a technical tie-up with Airbus I think Charles Pic has Lagardere backing...which I believe is affiliated in someway with Airbus (hence Safran?). Regardless, Airbus did make an appearance on the CT01 last season.

I know Van der Garde brought VoiceCash as well to his GP2 teams, but I don't think that's made an appearance this season.

I was under the impression that the partnership with Airbus was through Fernandes rather than the drivers - the Airbus deal coincided with him purchasing a number of new aircraft from them to expand his activities in Asia (the deal with General Electric came about due to him purchasing GE aviation engines). The Safran deal is possibly connected with Fernandes and the Airbus deal too - Safran supply parts to the aviation industry, so it's plausible that the two are linked.

That said, I do wonder what van der Garde brings to the team in terms of sponsorship - McGregor are, I believe, associated with van der Garde, and I would presume that Beelen, a Dutch specialist demolition company, would also be associated with van der Garde. Are there any other sponsors of Caterham associated with van der Garde?

I took a glance at van der Garde's website, where it also lists Regus, a multinational providing serviced office accommodations, and Maasfactor, which is apparently a Dutch advertising agency, as his personal sponsors.

Thanks for that - Regus is definitely listed on the Caterham website as a sponsor, although the latter, Maasfactor, is not at the moment. Nevertheless, it does look as if van der Garde is pulling in a fairly healthy number of sponsors - if anything, he seems to be bringing in more sponsors to the team than the team themselves can manage right now.

F1 is cited as a generally safe sport nowadays, but it is very sexist. Since the last female attempted to qualify for a race, there has been 2 driver deaths and 3 marshall deaths. And it has been over 21 years now, since Giovanna Amati was replace by a future World Champion....

I think it has less to do with Formula One specifically than the prejudice near the bottom of the ladder, which severely curtails the development of female talent through the feeder series. As far as I know, there's only one female driver in GP3 right now, and her performances have been underwhelming, to be diplomatic.

Obviously, there are female drivers with far more talent than the aforementioned GP3 pilot, but the problem rests in that they either can't raise enough sponsorship for a F3 seat or a seat in a similar entry-level racing series. With the exception of a very few, most female pilots in motorsport today are relatively mediocre drivers backed by a healthy sum of cash.

I'd have to agree that the bigger problem is that the talent pool of female racing drivers is pretty limited right now - Alice Powell has had some success in the junior series but her career has stalled a bit, though Beitske Visser is doing OK in the ADAC Formel Masters series (currently 9th out of 21 drivers). Without a sustained campaign to broaden the talent pool, at the moment there are simply not enough strong, capable female racing drivers coming through the junior series to make a serious impression and to move their way up into something like GP2 or FR3.5, where they could have a chance of moving up into F1.

[kevinbotz]

The sight of seeing Robin Frijns a man who should be in F1 just sitting on the sidelines doing nothing while Sergey Sirotkin who's a teenager is about to get a drive just sums up the money problems at the moment. Before the YDT at Silverstone i had no idea who Kimiya Sato was and his performance in today's AutoGP race was weak to say the least. We also had Susie Wolff who doesn't deserve to be anywhere near an F1 car (Sorry Baker) she was only a few tenths ahead of the Caterham's and Marussia's of all cars. And then you have the sight of the GP2 crash boys Cecotto and Canamasas having tests and also Roldolfo Gonzalez having a Marussia reserve drive plus the likes of Jake "1 podium in my entire career" Rosenzweig and Daniel "3 points in my time in FR3.5 and GP2 combined" de Jong staying in GP2 while Frijns gets booted out for money problems then i just don't see the point. I never really liked Frijns but seeing him get kicked out like this has made me have a change of heart towards him. Please can someone give him a reserve drive because of his talent and not because he brings money PLEASE?!!

Frijns is already a reserve for Sauber?

[Alextrax52]

The sight of seeing Robin Frijns a man who should be in F1 just sitting on the sidelines doing nothing while Sergey Sirotkin who's a teenager is about to get a drive just sums up the money problems at the moment. Before the YDT at Silverstone i had no idea who Kimiya Sato was and his performance in today's AutoGP race was weak to say the least. We also had Susie Wolff who doesn't deserve to be anywhere near an F1 car (Sorry Baker) she was only a few tenths ahead of the Caterham's and Marussia's of all cars. And then you have the sight of the GP2 crash boys Cecotto and Canamasas having tests and also Roldolfo Gonzalez having a Marussia reserve drive plus the likes of Jake "1 podium in my entire career" Rosenzweig and Daniel "3 points in my time in FR3.5 and GP2 combined" de Jong staying in GP2 while Frijns gets booted out for money problems then i just don't see the point. I never really liked Frijns but seeing him get kicked out like this has made me have a change of heart towards him. Please can someone give him a reserve drive because of his talent and not because he brings money PLEASE?!!

Frijns is already a reserve for Sauber?

Doh i've put this in the wrong thread mods can you move this post to the rantbox?

[go_Rubens]

Alice Powell is worthy of a mention.

True if anyone bothers to give her a chance. After all she is a Champion in the Minor British Classes

Yeah, but if I remember correctly, she doesn't have much financial backing. Shame.

[Bleu]

F1 is cited as a generally safe sport nowadays, but it is very sexist. Since the last female attempted to qualify for a race, there has been 2 driver deaths and 3 marshall deaths. And it has been over 21 years now, since Giovanna Amati was replace by a future World Champion....

I think it has less to do with Formula One specifically than the prejudice near the bottom of the ladder, which severely curtails the development of female talent through the feeder series. As far as I know, there's only one female driver in GP3 right now, and her performances have been underwhelming, to be diplomatic.

Two actually, but neither has scored points. Samin Gomez is the other one, but she has been invisible so far (in good and bad way)

[kevinbotz]

F1 is cited as a generally safe sport nowadays, but it is very sexist. Since the last female attempted to qualify for a race, there has been 2 driver deaths and 3 marshall deaths. And it has been over 21 years now, since Giovanna Amati was replace by a future World Champion....

I think it has less to do with Formula One specifically than the prejudice near the bottom of the ladder, which severely curtails the development of female talent through the feeder series. As far as I know, there's only one female driver in GP3 right now, and her performances have been underwhelming, to be diplomatic.

Two actually, but neither has scored points. Samin Gomez is the other one, but she has been invisible so far (in good and bad way)

Thanks for the correction.

[UncreativeUsername37]

You know what we could call Ekstrom's disqualification from the Norisring this year?

Watergate.

[RonDenisDeletraz]

Samin Gomez has been alright, better than Piria and especially Jorda but not as good as Powell.

I still do think that Beitske Visser is the best chance for a female F1 driver in the near future, pity that she has been quite unlucky in ADAC mMasters this year

[apple2009]

Her win at Sachsenring was anything but unlucky.

[CoopsII]

I wonder if any of the new breed of tracks, the Tilke-dromes etc, will ever be considered Historically Classic tracks? Will fans of the future look back all misty eyed about the good ole days at Buddh or Shanghai? I think the night/twilight races will but the others Im not so sure.

[good_Ralf]

I wonder if any of the new breed of tracks, the Tilke-dromes etc, will ever be considered Historically Classic tracks? Will fans of the future look back all misty eyed about the good ole days at Buddh or Shanghai? I think the night/twilight races will but the others Im not so sure.

I'll always remember Sepang and Shanghai, as well as Istanbul Park if it were still on the calendar. I also like Marina Bay and Yas Marina.

[Londoner]

It's starting to become a trifle odd considering the Sepang circuit as one of the "new circuits", as next year's race will be the 16th holding of the Malaysian GP.

To put that in perspective, I was 4 when the first race was held there in 1999. I'll be 19 when next year's race goes on...

[CoopsII]

It's starting to become a trifle odd considering the Sepang circuit as one of the "new circuits", as next year's race will be the 16th holding of the Malaysian GP.
To put that in perspective, I was 4 when the first race was held there in 1999. I'll be 19 when next year's race goes on...

So I guess theres little point in asking whether you think the TI track at Aida should make a comeback based on the two years of fairly decent racing that went on there?

[watka]

It's starting to become a trifle odd considering the Sepang circuit as one of the "new circuits", as next year's race will be the 16th holding of the Malaysian GP.
To put that in perspective, I was 4 when the first race was held there in 1999. I'll be 19 when next year's race goes on...

So I guess theres little point in asking whether you think the TI track at Aida should make a comeback based on the two years of fairly decent racing that went on there?

Not that I remember much as I was 5/6 at the time, but wasn't TI Aida meant to be far too narrow for good racing, like a Japanese Hungaroring?

[CoopsII]

Not that I remember much as I was 5/6 at the time, but wasn't TI Aida meant to be far too narrow for good racing, like a Japanese Hungaroring?

Possibly, but it was no narrower than Donnington was and even you young pups know how highly regarded the 1993 race is/was. I think Aida was binned because it was in a remote region.

[Londoner]

Not that I remember much as I was 5/6 at the time, but wasn't TI Aida meant to be far too narrow for good racing, like a Japanese Hungaroring?

Possibly, but it was no narrower than Donnington was. I think it was binned because it was in a remote region.

The 1995 race was pushed back several months to the end of the season, because of the earthquake in nearby Kobe I believe. So perhaps that might have been another reason F1 didn't go back.

[watka]

Not that I remember much as I was 5/6 at the time, but wasn't TI Aida meant to be far too narrow for good racing, like a Japanese Hungaroring?

Possibly, but it was no narrower than Donnington was and even you young pups know how highly regarded the 1993 race is/was. I think Aida was binned because it was in a remote region.

A bit different in the wet though.

[dr-baker]

Not that I remember much as I was 5/6 at the time, but wasn't TI Aida meant to be far too narrow for good racing, like a Japanese Hungaroring?

Possibly, but it was no narrower than Donnington was. I think it was binned because it was in a remote region.

The 1995 race was pushed back several months to the end of the season, because of the earthquake in nearby Kobe I believe. So perhaps that might have been another reason F1 didn't go back.

I love the fact that there were only two Pacific Grands Prix, and that Pacific GP team only survived two years, but that Pacific competed in both Pacific GPs! The only times that a team has competed in a GP of the same name... If only there had bee a GP in Jordan at the same time...

[watka]

It's a shame that EuroBrun never competed at a European GP.

[madmark1974]

There's also USF1 ...

Or we could revive the Birmingham Superprix and get Midland to race in it! Oh, and did we all forget Force India???

[good_Ralf]

There's also USF1 ...

Or we could revive the Birmingham Superprix and get Midland to race in it! Oh, and did we all forget Force India???

FI have already raced at their home GP and have scored points in both of them. Leyton House is a place, isn't it? Of course it isn't, it's an Japanese real estate company!

[dr-baker]

But the Pacific team were entered into the championship as... Pacific Grand Prix! So Pacific Grand Prix were an entrant at the Pacific Grand Prix!

[madmark1974]

On a related note, as Red Bull are based in the UK, but play the Austrian anthem when they win, which anthems would be played for the following teams? :

Force India - based in the UK but owned by an Indian.
Marussia - based in the the UK but owned by Russians.
Caterham - based in the UK, and manufacturer is UK, but owned by a Malaysian
Toro Rosso - based in the Italy, but owned by an Austrian

[good_Ralf]

On a related note, as Red Bull are based in the UK, but play the Austrian anthem when they win, which anthems would be played for the following teams? :

Force India - based in the UK but owned by an Indian.
Marussia - based in the the UK but owned by Russians.
Caterham - based in the UK, and manufacturer is UK, but owned by a Malaysian
Toro Rosso - based in the Italy, but owned by an Austrian

For Force India, I'm guessing the Indian national anthem. What else?!
Marussia I'm not sure.
In the 2012 season review, Jamie and Enoch played the Malaysian national anthem for Caterham, who had won ROTY!
When Toro Rosso won their only race, it was the Italian national anthem.

[madmark1974]

On a related note, as Red Bull are based in the UK, but play the Austrian anthem when they win, which anthems would be played for the following teams? :

Force India - based in the UK but owned by an Indian.
Marussia - based in the the UK but owned by Russians.
Caterham - based in the UK, and manufacturer is UK, but owned by a Malaysian
Toro Rosso - based in the Italy, but owned by an Austrian

In the 2012 season review, Jamie and Enoch played the Malaysian national anthem for Caterham, who had won ROTY!

Of course Toro Rosso did already win a GP, but I can't remember what anthem was played for Mr. Vettel's victory at the time ...

[Faustus]

On a related note, as Red Bull are based in the UK, but play the Austrian anthem when they win, which anthems would be played for the following teams? :

Force India - based in the UK but owned by an Indian.
Marussia - based in the the UK but owned by Russians.
Caterham - based in the UK, and manufacturer is UK, but owned by a Malaysian
Toro Rosso - based in the Italy, but owned by an Austrian

In the 2012 season review, Jamie and Enoch played the Malaysian national anthem for Caterham, who had won ROTY!

Of course Toro Rosso did already win a GP, but I can't remember what anthem was played for Mr. Vettel's victory at the time ...

When Toro Rosso won their only race, it was the Italian national anthem.

[watka]

It all depends what country the team is registered as, which you can see from the Wikipedia page:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F1_2013

[madmark1974]

It all depends what country the team is registered as, which you can see from the Wikipedia page:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F1_2013

Ok, I looked on the offical F1 site (and the FIA's) and it only said where they were based, not the country they were registered as. Just not entirely sure on the 'legitimacy' of Wikipedia info ...