2016 Silly Season Thread

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 28 Jan 2016, 16:46

In other Renault-related news...

Good one, Helmut.

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 28 Jan 2016, 17:19

Good on Magnussen, he deserves another chance.

As for Maldonado, I reckon he will get a Manor seat still.

Backmarker · Post by **Backmarker** » 28 Jan 2016, 17:30

DanielPT wrote:Good on Magnussen, he deserves another chance.

As for Maldonado, I reckon he will get a Manor seat still.

Does he want it? I wonder whether a move to Indy or NASCAR might be on the cards.

Post by **Ataxia** » 28 Jan 2016, 17:51

Rob Dylan wrote:http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122625
Now confirmed on Autosport. Poor Pastor getting dropped so late.

Then again there's still a chance he could get a last minute seat at Manor?

If this is absolutely 100% happening, this is amazing. I mean, it 100% makes sense; PDVSA cannot sustain Maldonado's career any further since oil prices have dropped through the floor (and as Londoner alluded to, the political turmoil that Venezuela is currently embroiled in). That said, I'm fully expecting PDVSA to magically get the money from somewhere and piss on our bonfires.

I'm fully aware that what I'm about to say is a bit hypocritical since I always harp on about giving drivers the benefit of the doubt, but Maldonado has had so many chances to prove himself and he's wasted them. After a wild first season I thought his win would showcase a new found maturity; it would be a result to silence the boo-boys and stake his place on the grid. But if anything, it made him even more insufferable. His decision-making on-track became more rash, and he tried far too hard. He got negative, started dragging his engineers through the mud and subsequently hasn't done one single noteworthy thing in his entire time at Lotus.

At Lotus, Grosjean has blown him away; at the start of 2012 they were very similar drivers, very wild, very accident-prone. One driver started to see a psychologist when things got too bad whilst the other refused to acknowledge his shortcomings and instead became complacent due to the whopping monetary incentive PDVSA were providing for him.

If Maldonado were to change his attitude, he'd get somewhere. Maybe he'd touch on that form from the start of 2012 again. However, I think it's too late; he's set in his ways, and with Venezuela's economy collapsing like a cheap bed, Maldonado's time is surely up.

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 28 Jan 2016, 18:44

Backmarker wrote:
DanielPT wrote:Good on Magnussen, he deserves another chance.

As for Maldonado, I reckon he will get a Manor seat still.

Does he want it? I wonder whether a move to Indy or NASCAR might be on the cards.

Why not? Manor will have a better engine and if they make good on their promises of an improved chassis for this year then they have a decent chance of ending up being a better prospect than Renault's underfunded chassis and most likely crap engine.

Jan Magnussen · Post by **Rob Dylan** » 28 Jan 2016, 18:52

But if this is Manor's chance to finally hit somewhere in the midfield, do they really want to risk Maldonado getting overeager and crashing points opportunities away? They really need a Reliant Robin.

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 28 Jan 2016, 19:14

Did someone just suggest Maldonado should go to NASCAR?

That's genius.

Someone make it happen.

Dj_bereta · Post by **Dj_bereta** » 28 Jan 2016, 19:57

The fame fate of Trulli. A single win and getting fired even after a contract renew just because money.

In the other side, this is going to be a risk move for Magnussen, since this is going to be a transitional year for Renault and is very likely they spend almost all year fighting with Sauber (or even Manor) with a potential unreliable car while he has a chance to secure a top seat in a near future in a other racing series, like WEC. Although the F1 teams are very aware of Magnussen's potential.

Post by **mario** » 28 Jan 2016, 20:11

Simtek wrote:In other Renault-related news...

Good one, Helmut.

I'm surprised that is being reported now given that Marko made those comments a few weeks ago.

That said, whilst Marko has an ego complex the size of a small nation state, in one respect there is some truth to what he is saying. Because Renault spun out negotiations with Lotus for such a long period of time, and in the process drove the team to the edge of bankruptcy, a sizeable chunk of Lotus's workforce were either made redundant or left the team over the course of 2015 - I've seen a suggestion that more than 90 people may have left the team over the past year as a direct consequence of Lotus's financial problems (a figure that is between 15-20% of their entire workforce).

When you add the severely depleted workforce onto a severely underdeveloped car - development work on their 2016 car effectively ground to a halt midway through the 2015 season - which is now being hastily modified to use Renault's 2016 engine, and the fact that the team will be dealing with two inexperienced drivers, Marko is probably right to say that Renault's 2016 season is likely to be pretty atrocious. In fact, I honestly would not be surprised if Renault find themselves right at the back of the midfield pack in 2016.

SuzukiSwift · Post by **SuzukiSwift** » 28 Jan 2016, 20:58

I like Pastor but if he isn't bringing the money it's not surprising he has been dropped. I would like him in a Manor seat.

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 28 Jan 2016, 21:20

Dj_bereta wrote:In the other side, this is going to be a risk move for Magnussen, since this is going to be a transitional year for Renault and is very likely they spend almost all year fighting with Sauber (or even Manor) with a potential unreliable car while he has a chance to secure a top seat in a near future in a other racing series, like WEC. Although the F1 teams are very aware of Magnussen's potential.

Well, it's risky compared to what, exactly? There's absolutely no substitute for an F1 race seat, and Magnussen is acutely aware of this. Getting in on the ground floor with Renault is absolutely a solid tactic - I mean, Rosberg pulled a similar move with Mercedes back in 2010 and it's worked out pretty well for him, hasn't it?

Post by **Ataxia** » 28 Jan 2016, 21:25

Dj_bereta wrote:The fame fate of Trulli. A single win and getting fired even after a contract renew just because money.

In the other side, this is going to be a risk move for Magnussen, since this is going to be a transitional year for Renault and is very likely they spend almost all year fighting with Sauber (or even Manor) with a potential unreliable car while he has a chance to secure a top seat in a near future in a other racing series, like WEC. Although the F1 teams are very aware of Magnussen's potential.

It's the opposite of Trulli's situation; they brought Petrov in because he HAD money at the time. Maldonado no longer has money, and clearly Renault have assessed his data and surmised that he's not worth keeping on.

For Magnussen, he's got no real other chance in F1 at the moment; everywhere else is a no-go, and if he were to go to IndyCar the chance of returning is slimmer than a worm in Victoria Beckham's gut. The aim must be to beat Palmer comprehensively.

SuzukiSwift · Post by **SuzukiSwift** » 28 Jan 2016, 23:09

Verdict on Palmer? I hope he does Ok but it's very hard to say here.

Aguaman · Post by **Aguaman** » 29 Jan 2016, 00:57

SuzukiSwift wrote:Verdict on Palmer? I hope he does Ok but it's very hard to say here.

Have to see what he does first.

I'm gonna miss Maldonado. Amazing guy. Crashes, drives fast and has an F1 win. We should celebrate him not talk about how he ruined his chances or whatever. This isn't Autosport, this is GP Rejects and here we celebrate the awesomeness that is Maldonado while mourning his career end.

AxelP800 · Post by **AxelP800** » 29 Jan 2016, 03:49

Though I still have hopes, I have to say Maldonado is one of the most underrated driver today. Certainly the talent is there, but the car, nope. One amazing win in his CV

On the other note: http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/marko ... am-670324/

If I'm Renault: "Okay Marko, good bye. No engines for you."

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 29 Jan 2016, 08:44

AxelP800 wrote:Though I still have hopes, I have to say Maldonado is one of the most underrated driver today. Certainly the talent is there, but the car, nope. One amazing win in his CV

Whilst I agree he gets far more hate than most drivers really deserve... The guy's almost 31 and he's still frequently making rookie errors - not as many as F1 Fanatic seem to be making out, but they are still happening. I'm going to miss the Reverend, but really, he hasn't delivered on the potential he showed in Spain frequently enough and at this point I don't think he ever will. Ataxia pretty much summed it up.

Aguaman wrote:I'm gonna miss Maldonado. Amazing guy. Crashes, drives fast and has an F1 win. We should celebrate him not talk about how he ruined his chances or whatever. This isn't Autosport, this is GP Rejects and here we celebrate the awesomeness that is Maldonado while mourning his career end.

The win kind of taints the charm a little bit, but I agree (ignore above paragraph)

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 29 Jan 2016, 09:24

All things considered I'll be sad to see Maldonado go. He's been a fairly divisive figure but he was also entertaining and F1 is only entertainment at the end of the day. The Spain win should at least cement his place with the other 'one hit wonder greats' we fondly remember like Panis, Alesi, and Kubica. And all the rest, that was off the top of my head.

girry · Post by **girry** » 29 Jan 2016, 11:42

It's very difficult for me to box Maldonado with those other "one hit wonders" you've listed because they deserved so much more. I mean it's obvious Kubica and Alesi should have won more than a single race, and even Panis probably would have won a race in '97 with his Bridgestones if he didn't have his injury.

Whilst Maldonado...was really fast on his day, but never in teh same consistent way as those. In retrospective, I'd rate him somewhere around Kovalainen...even if they're polar opposites on the driver spectrum lol.

Aguaman · Post by **Aguaman** » 29 Jan 2016, 13:32

I mean the guy isn't without his flaws. He over drivers a car if it isn't good, we've all seen it. He gets aggressive (which if Max does it Brundle hears a choir of angels) and such. But think about it this way? He had great performances in 2012, 2011 and even this season with great drives.

I know that autosport, so called 'true fans' of the sport or those that are like F1Fanatic people dislike him but the beauty of this site and the people on it is that we respect a driver regardless.

Forester · Post by **Forester** » 29 Jan 2016, 14:24

Yes, because this site has always been a bastion of respect for Jarno Trulli, Giancarlo Fisichella and Ralf Schumacher, hasn't it?

I know I haven't been around in a while, but from what I remember this site has generally respected drivers who put in effort. Maybe not always rewarded, maybe not always visible at first glance, but present nonetheless: even on the old You Lukcy B*****d page, there was a distinctly different tone between the entries for Johnny Dumfries and Christian Danner. Either that, or it gravitated around those who provide a decent story.

Maldonado does neither of those things, at least to me.

And also: Verstappen does get a lot of praise for being aggressive, and Maldonado doesn't. The difference is that Verstappen's is typically applied as part of good racecraft and without destroying someone else's race. Maldonado's is from refusing to temper his driving in any way.

Post by **Ataxia** » 29 Jan 2016, 14:47

Aguaman wrote:I mean the guy isn't without his flaws. He over drivers a car if it isn't good, we've all seen it. He gets aggressive (which if Max does it Brundle hears a choir of angels) and such. But think about it this way? He had great performances in 2012, 2011 and even this season with great drives.

...whilst I would argue that he hasn't; I can think of about four good drives from Maldonado, and two of those ended with collisions with something/someone late on in the race. In 2012 especially, that Williams should have been in the points week in, week out, and in Senna's hands it largely was (albeit in the lower reaches). Maldonado managed points finishes on five occasions, which is pretty dire. Senna managed 10, despite scoring fewer points. And again this season, Grosjean was the big hitter and scored points most weekends. Maldonado scored about half of his team-mate's points, and scored the same amount as Nasr despite the Sauber being inferior to the Lotus.

His win skews things; people use it as some kind of irrefutable argument-winner about his ability. At the time, I was cheering him on and was over the moon that he'd won. But as time goes on, it's clear that it's a complete outlier. A fluke. The result of nobody having a single clue about how the Pirelli tyres worked at the start of 2012, and Maldonado hit the triple-7s on that weekend.

Aguaman wrote:I know that autosport, so called 'true fans' of the sport or those that are like F1Fanatic people dislike him but the beauty of this site and the people on it is that we respect a driver regardless.

I can't abide by that; we aren't a collective "hivemind" that goes against the mainstream forums and websites. We're just an internet forum that has a bit more of a focus on the backmarkers, nothing to get elitist about.

Again, it's testament to his driving that Renault are looking to move him on as soon as he stops paying up; if he was good enough, they'd be keeping him. He's got no consistency, and in the area of the grid the teams he drove for occupied, points finishes are your bread and butter. You can't go out and get a top 6 result, and then spend the next ten races finishing 13th when the car is easily a points-scorer. A driver must perform to what the car is capable of on a standard weekend, and if the conditions are right then go out and get a big result.

good_Ralf · Post by **good_Ralf** » 29 Jan 2016, 16:10

Rest in pepperoni, Maldonado's career! He was improving his consistency, but even I have to admit it still wasn't good enough. Magnussen is more deserving of a seat than him, so it's good to see him back.
But I'm sure this board isn't going to forget him in a hurry.

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 29 Jan 2016, 16:14

Aguaman wrote:I know that autosport, so called 'true fans' of the sport or those that are like F1Fanatic people dislike him but the beauty of this site and the people on it is that we respect a driver regardless.

Er. I think the best I can say is that some of the criticism comes from a place of love.

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 29 Jan 2016, 16:51

I, on the other side, am looking forward to see how many of those in autosport and f1fanatic that regularly made fun of Maldonado will come forward and admit they will be wishing for Maldonado to be on the grid when things get desperately boring for them. I know at least they will secretly wish so.

A lot of Maldonado criticism is well deserved but the guy on his day was pretty fast. A daredevil, a loose cannon, a crazy maverick that gave a degree of unpredictability to the races. Again, I will certainly miss him.

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 29 Jan 2016, 17:03

SuzukiSwift wrote:Verdict on Palmer? I hope he does Ok but it's very hard to say here.

He's most likely gonna be trashed by Magnussen. He was pretty underwhelming for years in GP2, until he landed a gig with the best team in the series (and by quite some margin) in 2014. Magnussen, on the other hand, was able to force the most experienced driver in the field, a former WDC, to up their game.

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 29 Jan 2016, 18:30

SuzukiSwift wrote:Verdict on Palmer? I hope he does Ok but it's very hard to say here.

I would love to see the FIA bring in a budget normally-aspirated engine, and introduce a sub-championship for drivers using the engine. Maybe they could call it the Jim Clark Trophy. And the teams' version could maybe be named after Colin Chapman.

Wait, didn't that happen in 1987?

FullMetalJack · Post by **FullMetalJack** » 01 Feb 2016, 12:50

Yup, it's official

Glad to see Magnussen back in F1, I really hope he does well this season.

AdrianBelmonte_ · Post by **AdrianBelmonte_** » 01 Feb 2016, 16:24

He's gone, i'm trying to not cry, it's impossible for me...

WeirdKerr · Post by **WeirdKerr** » 01 Feb 2016, 20:50

CoopsII wrote:Did someone just suggest Maldonado should go to NASCAR?

That's genius.

Someone make it happen.

that would make spa 1998 look like ummm a slight mis-hap

SuzukiSwift · Post by **SuzukiSwift** » 01 Feb 2016, 23:41

RIP (to your F1 career) Pastor;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCnnYGVXegU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VMYAEHE2GrM

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 02 Feb 2016, 09:00

AdrianBelmonte_ wrote:He's gone, i'm trying to not cry, it's impossible for me...

Well look on the bright side; he had a smashing time in F1 and even won a race. In his career he was given more time than, arguably, better drivers have had in the past. Equally, he had more than enough time to showcase his skills to suggest to other teams he was worth a punt without the crates of cash PDVSA gave him but, in the modern F1 age, nobody wanted him.

Aguaman · Post by **Aguaman** » 02 Feb 2016, 14:09

A lot of pressure is on K-Mag to lead the team. He replaced Pastor and has a rookie teammate. Should be fun.

Aerond · Post by **Aerond** » 07 Feb 2016, 23:57

The only thing I'm gonna miss from Maldonado is that now the chances of watching a first lap accident are lower. That's about it.

CaptainGetz12 · Post by **CaptainGetz12** » 08 Feb 2016, 03:04

Aerond wrote:The only thing I'm gonna miss from Maldonado is that now the chances of watching a first lap accident are lower. That's about it.

Any chances that Romain Grosjean will pick up the slack?

Aguaman · Post by **Aguaman** » 08 Feb 2016, 08:50

CaptainGetz12 wrote:
Aerond wrote:The only thing I'm gonna miss from Maldonado is that now the chances of watching a first lap accident are lower. That's about it.

Any chances that Romain Grosjean will pick up the slack?

Kimi, Max, K-Mag, Nasr, the Great Marcus Ericsson or Ericsson the Great. Got a lot of people.

Aguaman · Post by **Aguaman** » 10 Feb 2016, 09:23

Pascal Wehrlein Manor. Done

Post by **Miguel98** » 10 Feb 2016, 09:38

Aguaman wrote:Pascal Wehrlein Manor. Done

Now, how should I put this: unless this gives a discount to Manor, I do not think Pascal is the right driver to focus on for the future (come beat me Klon). Yes, he's DTM champion, but only because Ekky didn't know how to qualify when it mattered and TEAMORDERSLOL. I think Vietoris, at least, is better than Wherlein, at least in single seaters inside the Mercedes team.

Backmarker · Post by **Backmarker** » 10 Feb 2016, 10:29

I have been unconvinced that Wehrlein is a great talent, but I think I don't give him enough credit.

- Won ADAC Formel Masters in 2011, but didn't really beat anyone great (except Roy Nissany).
- 2nd in first year of European Formula 3. Lost to Dani Juncadella, who was in his third season, and beat Raffaele Marcielo (also a debutant), Carlos Sainz, Jr. (in his second season), Felix Rosenqvist, etc.
- Improved year-on-year in DTM, winning the championship in his third season.

And all this before reaching 21. Yet I can only see him as being Paul di Resta level - which is not bad, especially in a team such as Manor - partly because I don't rate DTM, partly because I don't feel that I ever saw anything that special from Pascal Wehrlein. He's very reliable ( :chilton:

), which again will be beneficial when driving for Manor, but I can't say that I would be rushing to promote him to Mercedes any time soon. Maybe the good thing is that Toto can have an alternative to turn the screw on Bottas with regard performance and contract negotiations when Rosberg/Hamilton quit.

Post by **Ataxia** » 10 Feb 2016, 12:19

I'm sure my sitting-on-the-fence antics are getting tiresome, but let's give the lad a chance yeah? Of course, he's an unknown quantity and if this was 5 years ago I'd be agreeing with Miguel about the virtues of Christian Vietoris, but Wehrlein does seem to have a lot of potential.

Considering Mercedes have two of the best drivers on the grid and the data to compare them to Wehrlein, they must see something there too...

It's a statement of intent from Manor, and although I hope Rossi bags the other seat I believe it'll probably go Haryanto's way.

Collieafc · Post by **Collieafc** » 10 Feb 2016, 12:49

I think its a reasonable move by Manor - question marks or not, Pascal will be wanting to prove he is good enough for F1, and since he has already tested, a race seat at a lower team is sensible choreography by Mercedes. If he turns out to be good, Mercedes have an option to replace Rosberg should intra-team battles get out of hand with somebody who may have ability but not (yet?) of a level to challenge Hamilton, and not have to worry about complicated contracts. If he turns out to be bad, then Mercedes can focus their efforts elsewhere.

In return Manor get somebody who may turn out to be good, or at least minimising driver expense. There are far worse drivers than Pascal that they may have ended with.