Wonder how long it will take Ocon to butt heads with Bearman....
2024 discussion thread
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
As a stop gap they could use Buemi. Or bring Kvyat back for the millionth timemario wrote: ↑19 Jul 2024, 13:37The negotiations seem to have taken place during the opening races of the season when Perez was still putting in reasonable performances.sswishbone wrote: ↑17 Jul 2024, 07:06 Rumours are already swirling that Perez has two races to save his seat... if there's even a remote sniff of truth to this, why sign an extension in the first place?
There seems to have been an expectation that, with any potential distractions from the contract talks out of the way and a potential boost in confidence from signing that deal, Perez would maintain a more consistent level of performance. Instead, his performance declined after he signed that extension.
That's true - Ricciardo is reported to be under a bit of pressure himself over his performances, suggesting Red Bull might not be hugely confident he would be much better than Perez. The team also doesn't seem to think Tsunoda would be able to withstand the pressure associated with the role, and Lawson seems out of the question.Ducktanian wrote: ↑18 Jul 2024, 10:29You would think that if they were giving Perez such an ultimatum that they already have someone in mind as a replacement. But I'm not sure that they do.sswishbone wrote: ↑17 Jul 2024, 07:06 Rumours are already swirling that Perez has two races to save his seat... if there's even a remote sniff of truth to this, why sign an extension in the first place?
Some have proposed Sainz, but Jos sounds like he would do everything he could to avoid that, given how badly he reportedly got on with Sainz Sr. The lack of an appealing alternative is probably helping to keep Perez in that seat.
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
Well that performance has hardly helped Perez increase his standing in the team's view has it?
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
One word for that one, I think... sour.
I don't remember ever hearing a pair of race engineers sound as done with their drivers as Norris's and Verstappen's today. Particularly GP, who usually backs Verstappen to the hilt with everything but by the end had clearly had enough of him, which was extraordinary.
McLaren's problem always looked to be coming as soon as they brought Norris in first. Perhaps it was inevitable, but they'll be glad it didn't cost them anything in the end.
It's been a while since we last saw an F1 car go as high in the air as Verstappen's and keep going. I was very surprised he was able to bring that home.
I don't remember ever hearing a pair of race engineers sound as done with their drivers as Norris's and Verstappen's today. Particularly GP, who usually backs Verstappen to the hilt with everything but by the end had clearly had enough of him, which was extraordinary.
McLaren's problem always looked to be coming as soon as they brought Norris in first. Perhaps it was inevitable, but they'll be glad it didn't cost them anything in the end.
It's been a while since we last saw an F1 car go as high in the air as Verstappen's and keep going. I was very surprised he was able to bring that home.
Re: 2024 discussion thread
True, and it's also a bit surprising that Hamilton was able to keep going despite what must have been a pretty hefty blow to his car too - you'd have normally expected that to end with broken suspension for both drivers.Paul Hayes wrote: ↑21 Jul 2024, 14:46 One word for that one, I think... sour.
I don't remember ever hearing a pair of race engineers sound as done with their drivers as Norris's and Verstappen's today. Particularly GP, who usually backs Verstappen to the hilt with everything but by the end had clearly had enough of him, which was extraordinary.
McLaren's problem always looked to be coming as soon as they brought Norris in first. Perhaps it was inevitable, but they'll be glad it didn't cost them anything in the end.
It's been a while since we last saw an F1 car go as high in the air as Verstappen's and keep going. I was very surprised he was able to bring that home.
I agree that was probably the most fed up that GP has sounded on the radio with Verstappen, especially at the end when he called it "childish" to try and fight with other teams over the radio.
Martin Brundle, on watching a replay of Grosjean spinning:
"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
Re: 2024 discussion thread
Do we now have 13 race-winners on the grid? Everyone from the top five teams minus Stroll, plus Gasly, Bottas, Ricciardo and Ocon.
Is this a record?
Is this a record?
Re: 2024 discussion thread
It looks like others have also asked that question, and have worked out that the 1978 season had more race winning drivers on the grid (15).
Martin Brundle, on watching a replay of Grosjean spinning:
"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
Re: 2024 discussion thread
So, thanks to McLaren team orders, Perez is the only driver from the top 4 teams yet to win a race in 2024, whilst his teammate is currently the only multiple race winner, at 7. Yet Perez is still ahead of Russell in the Drivers Championship.
watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
We've now had 7 race winners in 2024, the most since 2012, when there were 8 different winners.
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
Yes, my immediate assumption when the crash first happened was that they were both going to be out.
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
Two Ferraris, two Red Bulls, two McLarens, Rosberg in the Mercedes, and Raikkonen in whatever the Enstone team was called that week?Har1MAS1415 wrote: ↑21 Jul 2024, 21:11 We've now had 7 race winners in 2024, the most since 2012, when there were 8 different winners.
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
I believe they were pretending to be Lotus that year...Paul Hayes wrote: ↑21 Jul 2024, 21:16Two Ferraris, two Red Bulls, two McLarens, Rosberg in the Mercedes, and Raikkonen in whatever the Enstone team was called that week?Har1MAS1415 wrote: ↑21 Jul 2024, 21:11 We've now had 7 race winners in 2024, the most since 2012, when there were 8 different winners.
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
Actually it was both Red Bulls, both McLarens, Nico for Merc, Nando for Ferrari, Kimi for Team Enstone and Maldonado for Williams.Paul Hayes wrote: ↑21 Jul 2024, 21:16Two Ferraris, two Red Bulls, two McLarens, Rosberg in the Mercedes, and Raikkonen in whatever the Enstone team was called that week?Har1MAS1415 wrote: ↑21 Jul 2024, 21:11 We've now had 7 race winners in 2024, the most since 2012, when there were 8 different winners.
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
We don't yet have a 2025 thread, but this would be a good starter...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/ar ... vg0zpyn5zo
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/ar ... vg0zpyn5zo
"Hispania are a waste of talent and petrol!" Martin Brundle, Australia Qualifying 2011
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
Sauber have actually officially performed worse than they did 10 years ago so far.sswishbone wrote: ↑23 Jul 2024, 16:05 We don't yet have a 2025 thread, but this would be a good starter...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/ar ... vg0zpyn5zo
2014 Best Result(s): 2 x 11th 1 x 12th
2024 Best after 13 races is an 11th and 3 13ths
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
Ah yes, of course!Har1MAS1415 wrote: ↑21 Jul 2024, 21:41Actually it was both Red Bulls, both McLarens, Nico for Merc, Nando for Ferrari, Kimi for Team Enstone and Maldonado for Williams.
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
With better luck. Perez and Hulk might have won a race that year too.Paul Hayes wrote: ↑24 Jul 2024, 17:28Ah yes, of course!Har1MAS1415 wrote: ↑21 Jul 2024, 21:41Actually it was both Red Bulls, both McLarens, Nico for Merc, Nando for Ferrari, Kimi for Team Enstone and Maldonado for Williams.
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
I think Grosjean retired from the lead of a race as well, though that might have been 2013...Har1MAS1415 wrote: ↑24 Jul 2024, 20:58With better luck. Perez and Hulk might have won a race that year too.Paul Hayes wrote: ↑24 Jul 2024, 17:28Ah yes, of course!Har1MAS1415 wrote: ↑21 Jul 2024, 21:41Actually it was both Red Bulls, both McLarens, Nico for Merc, Nando for Ferrari, Kimi for Team Enstone and Maldonado for Williams.
It's just unbelievable...that Formula 1 could be such a ridiculous melange of idiots.
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
Grosjean has lead a total of 40 laps across seven races (the Bahrain, Canadian and Hungarian GPs in 2012, and the German, Hungarian, Japanese and US GPs in 2013). However, Grosjean finished every one of those races and, with the exception of the 2013 Hungarian GP, he finished on the podium in those races.Row Man Gross-Gene wrote: ↑24 Jul 2024, 21:20I think Grosjean retired from the lead of a race as well, though that might have been 2013...Har1MAS1415 wrote: ↑24 Jul 2024, 20:58With better luck. Perez and Hulk might have won a race that year too.
Out of the three races that Grosjean lead in 2012, he finished in 3rd in Bahrain and Hungary (with Kimi ahead of him in both cases). The closest he came to winning one of those races in 2012 was the Canadian GP, where he finished in 2nd place and was only about 2.5 seconds behind Hamilton.
Martin Brundle, on watching a replay of Grosjean spinning:
"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
Re: 2024 discussion thread
The race you could be thinking of about Grosjean was possibly Valencia 2012 - I think he was about to inherit the lead from Vettel (or be a very close 2nd behind Alonso, I can't quite remember which) when him and Vettel had just about simultaneous alternator failures.
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
That's the one! So it wasn't from the lead, but when I saw Vettel pull off I was like YES! and then NO!James1978 wrote: ↑25 Jul 2024, 19:55 The race you could be thinking of about Grosjean was possibly Valencia 2012 - I think he was about to inherit the lead from Vettel (or be a very close 2nd behind Alonso, I can't quite remember which) when him and Vettel had just about simultaneous alternator failures.
It's just unbelievable...that Formula 1 could be such a ridiculous melange of idiots.
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
So a repeat of 1982 could have happened after all...Row Man Gross-Gene wrote: ↑25 Jul 2024, 20:26That's the one! So it wasn't from the lead, but when I saw Vettel pull off I was like YES! and then NO!James1978 wrote: ↑25 Jul 2024, 19:55 The race you could be thinking of about Grosjean was possibly Valencia 2012 - I think he was about to inherit the lead from Vettel (or be a very close 2nd behind Alonso, I can't quite remember which) when him and Vettel had just about simultaneous alternator failures.
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
Not sure we'll ever get a one-win world champion again, though!
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
Wow - what a performance from George. It did look as if his strategy would get him up onto the podium, but I imagine like most people I fully expected Hamilton to blast past him pretty easily on those much fresher tyres. But I guess George just kept enough in them to have something left at the end. Very nice for him to have a win that was *so* much down to him so soon after the one which fell into his lap, too.
There'll doubtless be a few others after this wondering why they didn't try a one-stop, too.
There'll doubtless be a few others after this wondering why they didn't try a one-stop, too.
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
And then...
Heartbreaking for Russell. That one's *really* got to hurt. Getting disqualified for being underweight in this day and age... And on today of all days.
Heartbreaking for Russell. That one's *really* got to hurt. Getting disqualified for being underweight in this day and age... And on today of all days.
Re: 2024 discussion thread
Does Sainz' signing for Williams really mean that both drivers are appendixless - what a weight-saving strategy
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
That's some gamble from Sainz that the current Williams project is going to pay off. But I suppose it would have been a similar gamble with any of his remaining options, really.
Re: 2024 discussion thread
It may be the case that he thinks Williams is the least bad option he had available from Alpine, Audi and Williams, given that the first two on that list are not the most stable of teams.Paul Hayes wrote: ↑29 Jul 2024, 18:44 That's some gamble from Sainz that the current Williams project is going to pay off. But I suppose it would have been a similar gamble with any of his remaining options, really.
The former, after all, is reportedly on the brink of ditching their engine programme for 2026, which seems to be creating considerable disquiet within the team, whilst Audi has recently also seen major changes with Binotto being brought in, reportedly because Seidl and Hoffmann were fighting each other so much that the only way it could be resolved was getting rid of both of them. Williams might not be as resource rich as those teams, but it doesn't have the same issues with internal instability that those teams have.
Martin Brundle, on watching a replay of Grosjean spinning:
"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
Re: 2024 discussion thread
Correct me if I'm wrong but Sainz going to Williams means I think he's the 1st driver to drive for all 4 of the 90s "Big Four", i.e. Ferrari, McLaren, Williams and "Team Enstone" (i.e. Toleman, Benetton, Renault, Lotus, and Alpine). Been wanting someone to do that for 30 years!!
"Poor old Warwick takes it from behind all throughout this season". (Tony Jardine, 1988)
Re: 2024 discussion thread
I think you are right - there are a few drivers who managed to tick off three of those, such as Mansell, but I don't think anyone managed all four of those teams.James1978 wrote: ↑29 Jul 2024, 20:18 Correct me if I'm wrong but Sainz going to Williams means I think he's the 1st driver to drive for all 4 of the 90s "Big Four", i.e. Ferrari, McLaren, Williams and "Team Enstone" (i.e. Toleman, Benetton, Renault, Lotus, and Alpine). Been wanting someone to do that for 30 years!!
Martin Brundle, on watching a replay of Grosjean spinning:
"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
No way! Though we came close in 2003 with Kimi and Kubica might have stood a chance in 2008.Paul Hayes wrote: ↑25 Jul 2024, 20:55Not sure we'll ever get a one-win world champion again, though!
Re: 2024 discussion thread
I can't say I understand going to Williams at all. In terms of 10 seats, they are firmly 9th, and could even be passed by Alpine if they sell out. But, it's easy to second guess from over here.
Professional Historian/Semi-Retired Drag Racer/Whiskey Enthusiast
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"When I was still racing, I never once thought 'Oh, I can't damage the car here'." - Jolyn Palmer
Me either Jolyn, maybe that's why we're both out, eh?
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
Didn't Prost do this? He drove for Renault, Ferrari, Mclaren and Williams. Unless 80's Renault weren't part of Enstone of courseJames1978 wrote: ↑29 Jul 2024, 20:18 Correct me if I'm wrong but Sainz going to Williams means I think he's the 1st driver to drive for all 4 of the 90s "Big Four", i.e. Ferrari, McLaren, Williams and "Team Enstone" (i.e. Toleman, Benetton, Renault, Lotus, and Alpine). Been wanting someone to do that for 30 years!!
"Hispania are a waste of talent and petrol!" Martin Brundle, Australia Qualifying 2011
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
When did Sainz drive for McLaren? I don't remember that.
watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
MCard LOLAdinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
Re: 2024 discussion thread
The late 70s/early 80s Renault were not Team Enstone. I know the water gets a bit muddy with there being 2 different versions of Renault but obviously I'm thinking for 10 (?) years the top 4 in the constructors were always in some order Ferrari, McLaren, Williams and Benetton. Then Renault took over Benetton in 2002.sswishbone wrote: ↑30 Jul 2024, 05:25Didn't Prost do this? He drove for Renault, Ferrari, Mclaren and Williams. Unless 80's Renault weren't part of Enstone of courseJames1978 wrote: ↑29 Jul 2024, 20:18 Correct me if I'm wrong but Sainz going to Williams means I think he's the 1st driver to drive for all 4 of the 90s "Big Four", i.e. Ferrari, McLaren, Williams and "Team Enstone" (i.e. Toleman, Benetton, Renault, Lotus, and Alpine). Been wanting someone to do that for 30 years!!
It's even more confusing with the 3 different versions of Lotus!! (Original Colin Chapman Lotus, Enstone Lotus and Caterham Lotus)!
Last edited by James1978 on 30 Jul 2024, 06:24, edited 1 time in total.
"Poor old Warwick takes it from behind all throughout this season". (Tony Jardine, 1988)
Re: 2024 discussion thread
2019 and 2020 (between Renault and Ferrari). It's where "Carlando" stemmed from when they were teammates
"Poor old Warwick takes it from behind all throughout this season". (Tony Jardine, 1988)
Re: 2024 discussion thread
2020 was such a strange season, for a whole number of reasons.
Professional Historian/Semi-Retired Drag Racer/Whiskey Enthusiast
"When I was still racing, I never once thought 'Oh, I can't damage the car here'." - Jolyn Palmer
Me either Jolyn, maybe that's why we're both out, eh?
"When I was still racing, I never once thought 'Oh, I can't damage the car here'." - Jolyn Palmer
Me either Jolyn, maybe that's why we're both out, eh?
Re: 2024 discussion thread
It's odd, it was immediately before his Ferrari stint but it seems as memorable as Villeneuve driving for Sauber...
watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
MCard LOLAdinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
It's weird, to me, that you think that, because it was his Renault season that I'd forgotten about, I thought his McLaren seasons were more memorable.
It's just unbelievable...that Formula 1 could be such a ridiculous melange of idiots.
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Re: 2024 discussion thread
Either way, I think his Toro Rosso days and his Ferrari days are more memorable than his days at Renault or McLaren.Row Man Gross-Gene wrote: ↑30 Jul 2024, 17:55It's weird, to me, that you think that, because it was his Renault season that I'd forgotten about, I thought his McLaren seasons were more memorable.
watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
MCard LOLAdinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.