Your Reject of the Race - Great Britain!

[Myrvold]

It sends a message that if you try to avoid a crash, you will be penalized/you will lose on it. However, if you do crash, it's ok.

But you're ignoring the fact that he wasn't penalised for avoiding a crash, he was penalised for the overtake. If he had simply avoided the crash and carried on with the battle, all would have been fine.

A overtake caused by the fact that he had to avoid a crash. Alonso could've braked on the inside, but there is no guarantee that he wouldn't have hit Kubica that way. As a racer, if I'm pushed of the track, and earns a spot of that, I wouldn't given it back by myself, it's not my problem that he pushed me off the track when he is supposed to leave enough room for me to travel in. That is what I'm basing my opinion on. Myself as a racer, and the rules that says that you ahve to give enough room.

[eagleash]

In fact, until Christian Horner joins the forum, you can indulge in calling him a bit of a spanner. In a nice way.

He may be here already, anyone can read this, & there are lots of members who don't post.

Christians in general should come out of the woodwork. We have no lions in here.

Christian Albers? Fittipaldi?

[CarlosFerreira]

He may be here already, anyone can read this, & there are lots of members who don't post.

Christians in general should come out of the woodwork. We have no lions in here.

Christian Albers? Fittipaldi?

All marching into Rome, yes.

[Captain Hammer]

So Ferrari for ROTR -except if they were actually informed that Alonso should let Kubica through when Kubica was already way behind because of his mechanical failure-.

They weren't. The article I linked to has Charlie Whiting telling the press that race control told both Ferrari and Alonso that he should move over and let Kubica through as soon as it happened. They ignored it, and were told twice more - and it wasn't until the third time that Ferrari told race control that Kubica was too far behind Alonso to give the place back. In short, Alonso brought a completely unnecessary penalty down upon himself.

[eagleash]

Christians in general should come out of the woodwork. We have no lions in here.

Christian Albers? Fittipaldi?

All marching into Rome, yes.

At least they're not marching into Florence.

"Onward Christian Soldiers marching as to war"

[tristan1117]

My RoTR goes to Ferrari and my local F1 broadcaster. Ferrari for obvious reasons and my local F1 broadcaster for tape delaying the race onto a major network to get 5 more F1 fans, right around the time I was supposed to go to a friend's world cup party.

EDIT: TO be fair, they do this every year and I always have to try to get an illegal Justin.Tv stream to watch live.

[McJaggers]

My RoTR goes to Ferrari and my local F1 broadcaster. Ferrari for obvious reasons and my local F1 broadcaster for tape delaying the race onto a major network to get 5 more F1 fans, right around the time I was supposed to go to a friend's world cup party.

EDIT: TO be fair, they do this every year and I always have to try to get an illegal Justin.Tv stream to watch live.

If it wasnt for my certain 'sources' id actually have to endure the horror of going to my parents house to watch the Aus:One Feed. Which is essentially two motorsports junkies of the lowest levels of sophistication, wearing pit lane headgear in a studio 17000km around the other side of the world.

For those pathetic stunts and having to see my parents every fortnight, id put One as the reject of the race every race weekend.

[MinardiFan95]

Ferrari: First they had Felipe baby. Now they have Fernando baby and he's throwing a temper tantrum.

Red Bull: "We treat our drivers equally". Yeah, right. I think Enoch summed it up best in the Turkish GP race review when he said Red Bull is F1's version of Animal Farm; all drivers are equal, but some are more equal than others.

And yet again, my winner for ROTR is...
The ONE/Ten Commentary team: Here is a quick summary of their commentary from the last round; "Blah blah blah *quick talk to "expert" at the track, James Allen* blah blah, Hispania shouldn't even bother, blah blah, Kovalainen was 100% to blame for the incident in Valencia, blah blah blah *mispronunciation of Kobayashi's name* blah blah *Fanboyish rant on Red Bull favouring Vettel instead of AUSTRALIA'S MARK WEBBER* blah blah *more Webber fanboyism* blah blah, The action is just heating up here at Silverstone, so we are going to a "quick" commercial break, blah blah *Craig Baird bagging out the new teams* blah blah *Greg Rust bagging out the new teams* blah blah, AUSTRALIA'S Mark Webber has won the British Grand Prix at Silverstone".

[Tealy]

A overtake caused by the fact that he had to avoid a crash. Alonso could've braked on the inside, but there is no guarantee that he wouldn't have hit Kubica that way. As a racer, if I'm pushed of the track, and earns a spot of that, I wouldn't given it back by myself, it's not my problem that he pushed me off the track when he is supposed to leave enough room for me to travel in. That is what I'm basing my opinion on. Myself as a racer, and the rules that says that you ahve to give enough room.

That is not the view of the FIA though, they decided that he should give the place back. In F1 if you ignore the FIA expect penalties or black flags.

An Example, Singapore 2009:

The race began shortly after 8pm local time with Lewis Hamilton making a clean start from pole position. Nico Rosberg took advantage of being on the clean side of the track to overtake Sebastian Vettel into the first corner. Fernando Alonso attempted to also pass Vettel but was unsuccessful, giving Mark Webber the opportunity to overtake Alonso on the outside of Turn 7. Both Alonso and Webber went off track as Webber completed the move. Stewards deemed Webber's move illegal and on lap seven he was told to hand the position back to Alonso, which also meant letting Timo Glock through as the German had also passed Alonso on the first lap.

Now in my opinion at that race Mark Webber had done nothing wrong in overtaking Alonso as he did. The stewards didn't see it that way though and told him to let 2 drivers past. Webber did so despite disagreeing with the decision. What everyone is critising Alonso & Ferrari for on this thread is not for getting past Kubica, but for not listening to the stewards and giving back the place when instructed to.

[Khausen Effect]

My view of the Alonso/Kubica incident is similar to some others, and I didn't see the penalty as fair. Alonso attempted something we all like to see, he passed around the outside. We saw he had to turn the wheel to avoid the accident so we know he was able to make the corner and didn't cut it because he was travelling too fast.

Alonso was fully alongside and was wheel to wheel with Kubica, so neither was ahead, although Alonso had the big advantage as the next, long, corner was a right-hander so he just about had the job done. Kubica then shoved him off the track.

The stewards penalising Alonso tells drivers that if any car is likely to pass them on the outside, he can be shoved off the track and either will not get past, or will get a penalty. This should further discourage overtaking and encourage dangerous driving.

So, my ROTR is whoever appointed a wash-up old bloke suffering from concussion as a driver steward.

[watka]

First things first, this is going in my sig bar:

I mean, Vettel destroys his wing, then they give him Webber's wing...

You buy ice cream to two kids, and one of the kids loose his ice on the ground, you don't take the ice from the kid that didn't loose it and give it to the clumsy kid, do you?

Anyway, here are my views of reject of the race:

Lotus - This was the weekend where they were meant to break away from Virgin and HRT (I think I've said this before at other races). However, qualifying ended with the Lotuses being split by Timo Glock, with Kovalainen only 3 tenths ahead of Glock. Perhaps their developments will bring a more noticeable difference at other tracks, but the weekend seemed to almost be a step backwards for them.

Vitantonio Liuzzi - Another disappointing weekend for Tonio. Disappointing qualifying, and he seems to lack that bit of something that Sutil has that makes Sutil a points scorer. Schumacher and Hulkenberg beat him despite being anonymous.

HRT - The whole thing with Yamamoto completely bemused me. Why take Senna away for one race, the race being probably the track that he knows best and has grown up with? And why replace him with Mr Dodgy Neck instead of Klien? I'm just surprised Yamamoto finished the race.

Ferrari - They avoid the RotR award by the skin of their teeth. Massa was P nowhere all weekend, and seems to have completely destroyed by Alonso's presence in the team. True, he had a puncture, but would he really have picked up any more than a handful of points? He seems to have just lost his fight, I've always seen him as a bit of a confidence driver. Alonso on the other hand, whilst unlucky, really should know better. I found myself completely agreeing with Captain Hammer's and fjackdaw's comments even before the article about him ignoring the stewards. I think it was at the very least a bit arrogant of Alonso to assume he could keep the position after going off the road and he clearly gained a position - he was behind/alongside but on the outside going into the corner, and ahead coming out of it.


But snatching it from Ferrari's nose is:

Christian Horner - This must be up there with the worst man management I have ever seen in any sport (you may have noticed that I have not had many kind words for Red Bull this season). In my humble opinion, he is a very weak team leader who is out of his depth, and who thinks he can make big decisions without considering the consequences. On pure mathematical logic alone, Vettel was ahead in the championship, so you give him the wing. However, this completely ignores the case that Mark Webber has been the better driver of late, that there is still a very, very long way to go in the championship, and that under no circumstances has Webber agreed to being the no. 2 driver in the team. The only way you can make this sort of decision is if you are Flavio Briatore or Jean Todt. Both had earnt respect over their time in F1, Horner has done nothing of the like. Even then, they made their rules absolutely clear from the start.

[Captain Hammer]

My view of the Alonso/Kubica incident is similar to some others, and I didn't see the penalty as fair. Alonso attempted something we all like to see, he passed around the outside. We saw he had to turn the wheel to avoid the accident so we know he was able to make the corner and didn't cut it because he was travelling too fast.

So you honestly believe that Alonso should not have been penalised? He was not penalised for running off the road - he was penalised for unfairly gaining a place and not giving it back.

Christian Horner - This must be up there with the worst man management I have ever seen in any sport (you may have noticed that I have not had many kind words for Red Bull this season). In my humble opinion, he is a very weak team leader who is out of his depth, and who thinks he can make big decisions without considering the consequences. On pure mathematical logic alone, Vettel was ahead in the championship, so you give him the wing. However, this completely ignores the case that Mark Webber has been the better driver of late, that there is still a very, very long way to go in the championship, and that under no circumstances has Webber agreed to being the no. 2 driver in the team. The only way you can make this sort of decision is if you are Flavio Briatore or Jean Todt. Both had earnt respect over their time in F1, Horner has done nothing of the like. Even then, they made their rules absolutely clear from the start.

Consider this for a moment: Red Bull's biggest problem in 2009 was that both their drivers were too busy taking points out of one another to mount a real challenge at Button. With the team wanting the titles this season, there was always going to come a point where they had to throw their support behind one of their drivers. They couldn't afford to let the saem thing happen again. Now, Vettel's wing failed at the end of FP3. Cars are under parc ferme conditions as of Q1. That gave the team very little time in which to make a decision. While Webber might have been the better driver of late, Vettel had been the faster driver at Silverstone, and was ahead on points. This was not an on-the-spot decision; if I were Horner, I would have taken as long as possible to make up my mind.

However, by the time the decision had been made and the wing had been carried over, Red Bull had no time to explain why they had made their change. The media and the fans then lit up with "Red Bull is favouring Vettel! Scandal! Scandal!" and judged them before they had a chance to give a reason why the change had been made. The fact that Webber is now content with Red Bull proves that their intentions were honourable: they had to maximise their chances of success. If there is any Reject here, it is over-reactions from the fans and media, judging Red Bull before the team even had a chance to explain themselves. Hell, they'd already judged the team based on Istanbul. There is absolutely no way Vettel's pole was a result of the wing change, unless Mark Webber drove a perfect lap and Vettel did not. One missed apex, one moment too soon on the brakes or too late on the throttle would have killed Webber's chances outright. In fact, the time Webber failed to match was actually slower than the time Vettel set for pole. Yet the fans forgot about that and seized the opportunity to attack Red Bull, more for Istanbul than anything else. Whatever happened until innocent until proven guilty? Or have we abandoned that in favour of guilty until proven dead?

[Khausen Effect]

My view of the Alonso/Kubica incident is similar to some others, and I didn't see the penalty as fair. Alonso attempted something we all like to see, he passed around the outside. We saw he had to turn the wheel to avoid the accident so we know he was able to make the corner and didn't cut it because he was travelling too fast.

So you honestly believe that Alonso should not have been penalised? He was not penalised for running off the road - he was penalised for unfairly gaining a place and not giving it back.

Yes, I honestly believe that Alonso had just about got the job done and would have won the place had he not been forced off the road. At the exit of the corner he was fully alongside Kubica on the right, front wheel to front wheel, with a very long right-hander to come. The move was 90% done.

According to the rules, he gained a place in a move that involved him leaving the circuit, and that carries a penalty. But I think that because his opponent forced him off, rather than going off himself, then there should be no penalty - Alonso was penalised for Kubica's move. Kubica drove Alonso off, and if he lost a place because of it (and I think it was already lost anyway) then he deserved to lose it.

I can see why Ferrari didn't want to give the place back without further discussion with the stewards, though that eventually cost them lots of places and points.

And, no, I'm not an Alonso or Ferrari fan. I just like to see clean racing.

[Captain Hammer]

Yes, I honestly believe that Alonso had just about got the job done and would have won the place had he not been forced off the road. At the exit of the corner he was fully alongside Kubica on the right, front wheel to front wheel, with a very long right-hander to come. The move was 90% done.

90% is not 100%. You can't go to the stewards and say "Well, clearly, he was almost past, so that makes it okay". Alonso was forced off the road because he attempted a pass and there wasn't enough room to make it stick. Robert Kubica had every right to choose his racing line into the corner and defend it, and that's exactly what he did.

According to the rules, he gained a place in a move that involved him leaving the circuit, and that carries a penalty. But I think that because his opponent forced him off, rather than going off himself, then there should be no penalty - Alonso was penalised for Kubica's move. Kubica drove Alonso off, and if he lost a place because of it (and I think it was already lost anyway) then he deserved to lose it.

Kubica did not force Alonso off. In fact, he probably wasn't aware Alonso was right on top of him - the HANS device makes it impossible for a driver to turn his head, and even if he could, the sides of the cockpit make it impossible to look directly to the left or right. Add to that the fact that the rear view mirrors only offer a very narrow field of view, and you can understand why Kubica didn't do anything wrong. In situations like this, the onus is always on the attacking driver to do it right. Because otherwise, you'd essentially be penalising Kubica simply for exercising his right to hold his line going into the corner.

I can see why Ferrari didn't want to give the place back without further discussion with the stewards, though that eventually cost them lots of places and points.

It doesn't matter what Ferrari want. What matters is what the rules say, and if the stewards tell you to give back the place, you give back the place. It was decided that Alonso had benefited from going off the circuit, and that's pretty much final.

I just like to see clean racing.

So do we all - but Alonso's move on Kubica was hardly clean.

[Myrvold]

Yes, I honestly believe that Alonso had just about got the job done and would have won the place had he not been forced off the road. At the exit of the corner he was fully alongside Kubica on the right, front wheel to front wheel, with a very long right-hander to come. The move was 90% done.

90% is not 100%. You can't go to the stewards and say "Well, clearly, he was almost past, so that makes it okay". Alonso was forced off the road because he attempted a pass and there wasn't enough room to make it stick. Robert Kubica had every right to choose his racing line into the corner and defend it, and that's exactly what he did.

Point is, neither of them was in front of eachother. Therefor, Neither of them had the right to push on out of the track. And when people are talking about the racing line... I've never seen anyone brake that defensive into that corner in the other laps. Alonso was on the racing-line if you mean there is such a thing...

According to the rules, he gained a place in a move that involved him leaving the circuit, and that carries a penalty. But I think that because his opponent forced him off, rather than going off himself, then there should be no penalty - Alonso was penalised for Kubica's move. Kubica drove Alonso off, and if he lost a place because of it (and I think it was already lost anyway) then he deserved to lose it.

Kubica did not force Alonso off. In fact, he probably wasn't aware Alonso was right on top of him - the HANS device makes it impossible for a driver to turn his head, and even if he could, the sides of the cockpit make it impossible to look directly to the left or right. Add to that the fact that the rear view mirrors only offer a very narrow field of view, and you can understand why Kubica didn't do anything wrong. In situations like this, the onus is always on the attacking driver to do it right. Because otherwise, you'd essentially be penalising Kubica simply for exercising his right to hold his line going into the corner.

This reminds me of Schumacher vs Montoya on Imola 2004...
""I actually got in front of him when we were braking," said Montoya. "Oh no, he didn't see me there. No chance. You've got to be blind or stupid not to see me.""
There is no way Robert Kubica didn't know that Alonso was there, he took a defensive line into the corner, and the front wheel of Alonso was ahead of Kubicas front wheel when they braked, he had to know he was there.
Even though I agree that the attacking driver has the main responsability to make the pass clean, you still have to give the other driver enough room, that is written in the rules. Robert Kubica did not do that. And Kubica's line is not overlapping Alonsos when they are side by side, then Kubica have to give enough room. Again, think of the last corner on Silverstone. You have guys that goes in deep, goes high up, and then cut's down on the exit. You have people that goes in high, hit's the cerb in the middle of the corner and drifts out. And you have people that goes in low, stays low, and drifts out. That is three different ways to take the corner.
Let's say driver A and driver B are in a fight there. Driver A goes in low, then in the middle is high, and exiting. Driver B is going in high, hits the cerb in the middle and drifts out. If they get side by side here, with your logic, both are keeping their racing line, but they cross, and they will crash.
Then, if they both follow the rules, they know that they have to make their car that far in/out that they give the other vehicle enough room to keep on the track. Whatever line they have chosed.

I can see why Ferrari didn't want to give the place back without further discussion with the stewards, though that eventually cost them lots of places and points.

It doesn't matter what Ferrari want. What matters is what the rules say, and if the stewards tell you to give back the place, you give back the place. It was decided that Alonso had benefited from going off the circuit, and that's pretty much final.

Yes, but you still can talk your case, you can say what you feel, and how you feel things are, maybe they will change their minds. When they got the penalty, they didn't complain on it. They just say that they feel they did right, but accepts it.

I just like to see clean racing.

So do we all - but Alonso's move on Kubica was hardly clean.

It wasn't... Because Kubica didn't give enough room, like he is supposed to, if he'd done that, none of this would've happend.

[Captain Hammer]

Point is, neither of them was in front of eachother. Therefor, Neither of them had the right to push on out of the track. And when people are talking about the racing line... I've never seen anyone brake that defensive into that corner in the other laps. Alonso was on the racing-line if you mean there is such a thing...

If neither driver is in front, the defending driver still has right of way. An attacking driver does not have right of way until he is visibly in front of the driver he is attempting to pass.

It wasn't... Because Kubica didn't give enough room, like he is supposed to, if he'd done that, none of this would've happend.

Again: a defending driver is under no obligation to make way for an attacker. If a defending driver must give way as soon as an attacker makes his move, then you create a rather sticky situation where a driver cannot defend his line, which is his right. I don't know where you've gotten this idea that a defending driver must suddenly jump out of the way of an attacking driver from.

I'm sorry, but Alonso was clearly in the wrong on this one. It doesn't matter if he ran out of room, because it's not Kubica's job to make him look like he sucks less than he actually does. Alonso did not and would not have right of way until he was past Kubica - and he wasn't past until after he rejoined the circuit.

[DonTirri]

Jesus fellas, STOP IT ALREADY.

What is really a small incident in a race filled with bigger and a LOT MORE IMPORTANT events, has become the hot topic simply cause people can't understand the fact that IT DOESN'T MATTER WHETHER KUBICA DROVE ALONSO OFF THE ROAD OR NOT, ALONSO WASN'T PENALIZED FOR CUTTING THE CORNER, HE WAS PENALIZED FOR NOT GIVING BACK THE POSITION HE GAINED BY DOING SO. SO ARGUING WHETHER KUBICA DID WRONG OR IF KUBICA HAD THE RIGHT TO DEFEND IS GODDAMN IRRELEVANT SO STOP IT!!!!

[Klon]

Capslock is cruise control for cool, keep on pushing.

[Myrvold]

Point is, neither of them was in front of eachother. Therefor, Neither of them had the right to push on out of the track. And when people are talking about the racing line... I've never seen anyone brake that defensive into that corner in the other laps. Alonso was on the racing-line if you mean there is such a thing...

If neither driver is in front, the defending driver still has right of way. An attacking driver does not have right of way until he is visibly in front of the driver he is attempting to pass.

It wasn't... Because Kubica didn't give enough room, like he is supposed to, if he'd done that, none of this would've happend.

Again: a defending driver is under no obligation to make way for an attacker. If a defending driver must give way as soon as an attacker makes his move, then you create a rather sticky situation where a driver cannot defend his line, which is his right. I don't know where you've gotten this idea that a defending driver must suddenly jump out of the way of an attacking driver from.

I'm sorry, but Alonso was clearly in the wrong on this one. It doesn't matter if he ran out of room, because it's not Kubica's job to make him look like he sucks less than he actually does. Alonso did not and would not have right of way until he was past Kubica - and he wasn't past until after he rejoined the circuit.

No driver has the right to driver where he wants if there is a car there, that doesn't matter if you are defending or attacking, if there is a car on you side, respect it.

I don't know if you haven't understood me, or if you with purpose are giving me opinions I don't have... I have never said that a defending driver must jump out of the way, but in this situation Kubica choosed the inner line, Alonso the outer, they were side by side, then Kubice have to keep his inner line, because there are a car on his side. It isn't harder than that.
However, it have now been legal to do this, and I guess you will see more and more drivers do it, until something happens...

[mediocre]

Back to topic: my reject of the race is Niki Lauda for saying on German television before the qualifying that Vettel's wing is completely destroyed, cannot be used, blah blah.

[CarlosFerreira]

Jesus fellas, STOP IT ALREADY.

What is really a small incident in a race filled with bigger and a LOT MORE IMPORTANT events, has become the hot topic simply cause people can't understand the fact that IT DOESN'T MATTER WHETHER KUBICA DROVE ALONSO OFF THE ROAD OR NOT, ALONSO WASN'T PENALIZED FOR CUTTING THE CORNER, HE WAS PENALIZED FOR NOT GIVING BACK THE POSITION HE GAINED BY DOING SO. SO ARGUING WHETHER KUBICA DID WRONG OR IF KUBICA HAD THE RIGHT TO DEFEND IS GODDAMN IRRELEVANT SO STOP IT!!!!

Yes. Please. Thank you.

[Debaser]

Don Tirri - sure you don't need an aspirin, some paracetamol and a cold towel over your forehead to cool you down before you explode??? Nonetheless I agree with you, this debate is tiresome and its time everyone moved on. Both Renault and Ferrari had rubbish races and are ROTR worthy, Ferrari lacked reliabilty and judgement while Renault lacked pace.

[CarlosFerreira]

Nonetheless I agree with you, this debate is tiresome and its time everyone moved on. Both Renault and Ferrari had rubbish races and are ROTR worthy, Ferrari lacked reliabilty and judgement while Renault lacked pace.

Great on that bit; but please don't make it personal, lads.

This is F1Rejects. Alonso, Kubica, Renault, Ferrari - who cares?

[Captain Hammer]

No driver has the right to driver where he wants if there is a car there, that doesn't matter if you are defending or attacking, if there is a car on you side, respect it.

Except that there wasn't a car in Kubica's way. He was in front, which means he had right of way. If anyone was in the other driver's way, Alonso was in Kubica's.

[Myrvold]

Again. A car is side by side when the front wheel is in front of the other cars back wheel. (This is not accepted in practice, but it's written). However, Alonso have even braked later than Kubica, and his front wheels are in front of Kubicas front wheels at the moment they start to turn. Again.

Are you telling me that Kubica is in front of Alonso here? And have in mind, from Alonsos onboard cam, have Kubica disappeared when they are braking, in other words, Kubica is even further behind in the braking area, and Alonso is braking later.
And then you are talking about the line, Kubuca's line is on the inside, he have to keep his car there, just the way Alonso have to keep his car on the outside. You would've complained on Alonso if he'd turned in early and cut across Kubica, because Kubica was there, even though Alonso was further "in front" of Kubica before the turn that Kubica is on Alonso in the picture (even though, that is defined as side by side...)

[Captain Hammer]

While Alonso is physically in front, Kubica is technically in front because Alonso's trajectory will take him off the road. Even without Kubica there, he would end up going off the circuit if he continued to follow that line. Alonso might be in front, but Kubica has the racing line going into Club. Given how close they are to the corner, there is no way Alonso could stay on the circuit and stay in front of Kubica.

I'm sorry, but DonTirri was right: this doesn't matter. Alonso was not penalised for passing Kubica, he was penalised for going off the circuit and not giving the place back.

[Myrvold]

You do know that Alonso couldn't turn more in because of the fact that it was a Renault there... And there is no such thing as "the racing line has the right" there is no such thing a "the racing line" in the rules. And by that argument, Alonso should've cutted across in front of Kubica because he had "the racing line". And for the next corner, Alonso's job had been to keep the inside while Kubica got the outside (which I guess would be the clearly faster one)

[DemocalypseNow]

FOR THE LOVE OF GOD STOP IT ALREADY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jeez, this is Reject of the Race, not the Alonso vs Kubica wrestling match.

[Cynon]

FOR THE LOVE OF GOD STOP IT ALREADY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jeez, this is Reject of the Race, not the Alonso vs Kubica wrestling match.

DAMMIT MAN!!!

I was just going to place 20 on Kubica to win that match...

[TomWazzleshaw]

FOR THE LOVE OF GOD STOP IT ALREADY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jeez, this is Reject of the Race, not the Alonso vs Kubica wrestling match.

DAMMIT MAN!!!

I was just going to place 20 on Kubica to win that match...

I was about to place 15 on that match too... goddamnit Kostas

[Myrvold]

And I was collecting the money, just to run away... Thanks

[LukeB]

Alonso and Kubica are just like the Nazis.
There, thread over. We can all move on with our lives.

[mario]

FOR THE LOVE OF GOD STOP IT ALREADY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jeez, this is Reject of the Race, not the Alonso vs Kubica wrestling match.

Sadly, I think that this is going to rumble on, regardless of our requests to those involved to calm down and take a step back.
Is there any way in which the recent posts relating to the Alonso-Kubica incident can be moved to a separate thread, which could be dedicated to debating this issue? That way, we would be able to separate this debate from the general debate about who underperformed the most during the race weekend (which is what we are supposed to be debating).

[coops]

Is there any way in which the recent posts relating to the Alonso-Kubica incident can be moved to a separate thread, which could be dedicated to debating this issue? That way, we would be able to separate this debate from the general debate about who underperformed the most during the race weekend (which is what we are supposed to be debating).

Snigger. I just made a mass-debate joke in my head. It was funny.

[Klon]

Jeez, this is Reject of the Race, not the Alonso vs Kubica wrestling match.

I'd mark for that match however, where is TNA and their ... questionable ... hire policies when you need them.

[DonTirri]

Jeez, this is Reject of the Race, not the Alonso vs Kubica wrestling match.

I'd mark for that match however, where is TNA and their ... questionable ... hire policies when you need them.

Questionable? Atleast TNA ain't pushin the same boring ass guys year after year. RVD, Styles, Angle, Anderson etc > Cena, HHH and the likes.

[dr-baker]

Is there any way in which the recent posts relating to the Alonso-Kubica incident can be moved to a separate thread, which could be dedicated to debating this issue? That way, we would be able to separate this debate from the general debate about who underperformed the most during the race weekend (which is what we are supposed to be debating).

Snigger. I just made a mass-debate joke in my head. It was funny.

[watka]

For the record, I have read your response to my comments on Horner and I disagree.

For the sake of avoiding the wrath of a certain Scotsman, I will say no more and look forward to the next race.

[DemocalypseNow]

People fear me.





Awesome.

[watka]

People fear me.





Awesome.

I don't think that Captain does, but I do.