BBC news quoting Robert Kubica 'seriously injured'

The Passenger · Post by **The Passenger** » 06 Feb 2011, 16:13

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/89312

Apparently his hand isn't in danger of being amputated, but they're still working on restoring its functionality.

patrick · Post by **patrick** » 06 Feb 2011, 16:13

JeremyMcClean wrote:I doubt he'll miss any races.

Because he's been through worse and he's only missed one race due to that.

Considering that, I think he'll be A-OK for the start of the season, though he may be shaken up.

Oddly enough, the last time he was injured and missed a race; his replacement was Sebastian Vettel. I wonder if there's going to be any more from the replacement? Or is this just a one-off good drive from the driver?

A sad but true quote from one of the users in the pages' comment section:
User from Eurosport.com wrote:This is why F1 drivers should not do filler sports.

Sorry, but you're wrong - I'll be very happy if this is the case, but sadly, the difference between now and canada is that he has very serious physical injuries.
The latest from the press conference in Italy is that there is no danger to his life, the internal injuries are no longer dangerous but he is undergoing heavy surgery to his right hand. It does not need to be amputated but the functionality is yet to be determined. Surgery is due to finish in several hours' time.

The very best we can hope for is that he recovers for the midseason, but it is very likely he may have permanent damage to his hand. Good luck, robert

Aerospeed · Post by **Aerospeed** » 06 Feb 2011, 16:15

patrick wrote:
JeremyMcClean wrote:I doubt he'll miss any races.

Because he's been through worse and he's only missed one race due to that.

Considering that, I think he'll be A-OK for the start of the season, though he may be shaken up.

Oddly enough, the last time he was injured and missed a race; his replacement was Sebastian Vettel. I wonder if there's going to be any more from the replacement? Or is this just a one-off good drive from the driver?

A sad but true quote from one of the users in the pages' comment section:
User from Eurosport.com wrote:This is why F1 drivers should not do filler sports.

Sorry, but you're wrong - I'll be very happy if this is the case, but sadly, the difference between now and canada is that he has very serious physical injuries.
The latest from the press conference in Italy is that there is no danger to his life, the internal injuries are no longer dangerous but he is undergoing heavy surgery to his right hand. It does not need to be amputated but the functionality is yet to be determined. Surgery is due to finish in several hours' time.

The very best we can hope for is that he recovers for the midseason, but it is very likely he may have permanent damage to his hand. Good luck, robert

FECK

patrick · Post by **patrick** » 06 Feb 2011, 16:18

One thing to consider, however, is that doctors reportedly wanted to remove Herbert's injured legs after his brands hatch crash all those years ago. They did not, and of course we know that johnny went on to have a great career. Let's hope this is the case for robert!

Paul Hayes · Post by **Paul Hayes** » 06 Feb 2011, 16:24

patrick wrote:One thing to consider, however, is that doctors reportedly wanted to remove Herbert's injured legs after his brands hatch crash all those years ago. They did not, and of course we know that johnny went on to have a great career. Let's hope this is the case for robert!

Sadly, however, we live in the skewed, parallel universe where Johnny Herbert never became world champion.

I'd be very happy to see Kubica come back and win three races after this, though.

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 06 Feb 2011, 16:45

P_Friesacher wrote:No, it's not Andorra, small state, but Andora, Italian village.

noisebox wrote:
dr-baker wrote:Can somebody clarify something for me? Robert crashed on the Ronde di Andora rally, which I'm assuming is in Andorra, between Spain and France, yet was taken to a northern Italy hospital. Was they rally not in Andorra after all, or is there a reason why he was taken all the way to Italy?

No, it's an Italian rally:
http://www.rally.it/showthread.php/3080 ... ndora-2011

Thanks - that makes a lot more sense in context than Andorra.

And as regards the hand, some drivers are already expressing concern about there being too many buttons to operate this year. Might this be a hindrance to Robert's return if he had problems with his hand?

F1000X · Post by **F1000X** » 06 Feb 2011, 16:47

Gentlemen, we can rebuild him. We have the technology. We have the capability to build the world's first bionic Pole. Robert Kubica will be that man. Better than he was before. Better...stronger...faster.

He will be back before the end of the season.

Aerospeed · Post by **Aerospeed** » 06 Feb 2011, 16:48

Well, for me, I think Kubica is coming back for sure, but he's probably at this rate going to miss three races and underpreform in the races he does attend. We are having a 20-race season this year, it is very gruelling. When Stefan Bellof died in Spa-Francorchamps in an endurance race, many people decided to hold back drivers from running in events that mean diddly-squat in the championship, and also removing the risk of being injured in the "silly races." Sure, Rallying is a good event, but right now, Rallying is for Rally drivers and F1 is for F1 Drivers, and it should bathplug stay that way, dam it!

dinizintheoven · Post by **dinizintheoven** » 06 Feb 2011, 16:56

Obviously this is a horrifying development and I can add no more to that debate except to say that I wish Robert Kubica as quick and complete a recovery as Felipe Massa, Heikki Kovalainen and Michael Schumacher before him, amongst others who did not survive completely intact - the Zanardis, Nanninis, Regazzonis and Streiffs of this world.

I see someone's beaten me to posting about who Kubica's replacement was last time he had a horror crash, and we all know how his career progressed. Nobody wants to drop into an F1 seat in this way - ask Patrick Tambay and David Coulthard how they felt about taking the place of a recently-deceased legend - but someone has to do it. And I know some of you want to see Bruno Senna or Rrrrmmn Grrrrsjjn in the no. 9 car for the coming season (or the start of it, at least), but may I offer an alternative? Danny Bahar, or Éric Boullier, or whoever it is who is actually running the Lotus-branded-Renault team, should have a word in Vijay Mallaya's ear and do everything possible to obtain the services of Nico Hülkenberg, offering one (or maybe two?) of his test drivers in exchange. The debate raged last year as to whether The Hulk or Vitaly Petrov was actually the better driver last season; Hulk scored that pole position, but Petrov scored five more points, although his Renault was a more competitive car than the Williams, and Hulk had a far greater percentage of his experienced team-mate's points than Petrov did... these two drivers fought each other for the GP2 title in 2009, let's put them in the same F1 car for 2011 and have a straight shoot-out to see who's really the better driver of the two.

Vepe · Post by **Vepe** » 06 Feb 2011, 16:56

This was on http://www.mtv3.fi/urheilu/ralli/uutiset.shtml/2011/02/1269003/kubican-kilpakumppani-raivoissaan-kukaan-ei-edes-hidastanut-onnettomuuspaikalla

I translated it but it´s not the best translation:

Amongst the first fellow competitors to stop at Kubicas crash site, Mauro Moreno said that many of the other competitors drove by without even slowing down.

- It is disgusting that many just drove by probably thinking that "I´m going to win these two cars. One because it crashed, and the another, because the idiot stopped to help."

- We drive for fun, we´re not professionals, so the sport should be fun and relaxing. That is why I feel sick about the situation.

I don´t know what to say of this.

Jim Clark Forever · Post by **Jim Clark Forever** » 06 Feb 2011, 17:05

patrick wrote:One thing to consider, however, is that doctors reportedly wanted to remove Herbert's injured legs after his brands hatch crash all those years ago. They did not, and of course we know that johnny went on to have a great career. Let's hope this is the case for robert!

I was at Brands on that terrible day - horrible memories. But the sad fact was Herbert was never quite the same driver again afterwards - I remain convinced that he would have been a multiple world champion otherwise. Terrible arm injuries in a helicopter crash ended Nanini's career. I wish Kubica all the best for a full and speedy recovery, but from the sound of the reports I for one doubt that we will see him in a race this season, sadly. Sadly I don't see Petrov and Senna as a credible driver pairing for Renault either.

Myrvold · Post by **Myrvold** » 06 Feb 2011, 17:12

Vepe wrote:I don´t know what to say of this.

Adrenaline and racing. If the co-driver signed for help, it is disguisting, if not, it's normal.
I remember I stopped to help a fellow driver in a kartrace, the only reason was becuase the year before, I had a life-treathning accident. If not, I wouldn't given it a second thought.

Collieafc · Post by **Collieafc** » 06 Feb 2011, 17:18

Hope hes ok. It would be criminal if he is out for a portion of the season, only to find that the Renault is (or could be) a title winner in his hands

Post by **DemocalypseNow** » 06 Feb 2011, 17:20

This could be fate.

With Kubica gone they will need a replacement for the opening race...such as their test driver.

Senna. In a black and gold Lotus-Renault.

I'm not saying he will at all, but it would be rather eerie if he did end up winning the opening race.

Aerospeed · Post by **Aerospeed** » 06 Feb 2011, 17:29

kostas22 wrote:This could be fate.

With Kubica gone they will need a replacement for the opening race...such as their test driver.

Senna. In a black and gold Lotus-Renault.

I'm not saying he will at all, but it would be rather eerie if he did end up winning the opening race.

Considering Renault's wonderful decision making, they'll probably pick the crappiest driver and have him place no higher than 15th. That's what they get for ploping Kubica into this mess. Renault can go suck an egg.

I never quite liked Renault anyways.

Paul Hayes · Post by **Paul Hayes** » 06 Feb 2011, 17:33

kostas22 wrote:Senna. In a black and gold Lotus-Renault.

Johnny Dumfries's nephew believed to be clearing his diary as we speak...

DOSBoot · Post by **DOSBoot** » 06 Feb 2011, 17:35

Poor Robert, just when things were looking good for him again.

That guy just has bad luck at the wrong time, much like Alesi, Nanni, and Heidfeld. I hope he recovers soon enough.

patrick · Post by **patrick** » 06 Feb 2011, 17:51

F1Photographer Darren Heath
Is driving #F1 not enough for #Kubica? Utterly irresponsible to crash in a club rally.Can't see #Alonso, #Vettel, #Hamilton being so stupid.

oh dear...

Myrvold · Post by **Myrvold** » 06 Feb 2011, 18:04

Of course... "Utterly irresponsible to crash in a club rally.Can't see #Alonso, #Vettel, #Hamilton being so stupid." No, they would NEVER crash...

Post by **mario** » 06 Feb 2011, 18:07

Having been away for most of the day, I've only just started reading about what has happened, and I'm pretty stunned by it.
When I first heard the news on the radio, perhaps naively I though (or at least hoped) that the reports were overstated, but seeing how the barrier has punched its way through the car, in some ways Kubica is lucky that he wasn't more severely injured. I wish him a speedy recovery, and hope that he can get back to full fitness again - but an injury like this could well be the end of his career (and tragically we've seen too many promising careers cut short by unfortunate crashes).

This must be a major morale blow to Renault too, since Kubica had worked hard to integrate himself into the team to push them forwards. They have the unenviable task of finding a driver to fill his seat, which is a big step up for all of their reserve drivers, especially at a time when the team are heavily relying on their drivers to develop the cars. And I can't imagine that it must be easy for the reserve drivers either to find themselves in the drivers seat in such circumstances - it's going to be a real test of both drivers and team now.

Barbazza · Post by **Barbazza** » 06 Feb 2011, 18:37

I hope he makes a comeback, for me he's one of the few exciting F1 drivers with real potential that we have these days.

Post by **DemocalypseNow** » 06 Feb 2011, 19:16

@OfficialLRGP wrote:Robert should be out of surgery soon. We hope to be able to give you another update in a couple of hours.

The wait continues...

This can't be a good sign. They expected the surgery to be done by 4pm local time. It's now past 8pm in Genoa. I'm becoming more worried as the hours pass...

Klon · Post by **Klon** » 06 Feb 2011, 19:27

kostas22 wrote:This can't be a good sign. They expected the surgery to be done by 4pm local time. It's now past 8pm in Genoa. I'm becoming more worried as the hours pass...

That itself should not lead to panic. Such operations always take longer than planned simply due to not being able to know what you get once you have "opened" the patient. And from operation to usable news takes some time as well. I'd be surprised if we have anything useful before midnight (CET).

karsten · Post by **karsten** » 06 Feb 2011, 19:41

i hope it's not another nannini... i was so down at that time him being an italian and an impressive fast one...

i expected him to be WC in a couple years... as i expect kubica too...

Cynon · Post by **Cynon** » 06 Feb 2011, 19:48

Assuming Kubica is out for an extended period of time, does this mean that the team will put Petrov as their #1 driver and Senna as the #2? Or will Senna immediately take #1 status in the team?

It's a shame it happened, but for the sake of keeping F1 drivers as human as possible, they should be allowed to take these excursions.

Paul Hayes · Post by **Paul Hayes** » 06 Feb 2011, 19:58

I remember hearing a - possibly apocryphal - story that Derek Warwick got the Brabham drive in 1986 at least partly because he was the only out-of-work F1 driver who didn't immediately contact Bernie Ecclestone about the drive after Elio di Angelis was killed.

I wonder how cynical the current out-of-work crop, or their managers, have been? I'd be amazed if there hadn't been one or two phone calls to Enstone already, frankly. That's what F1 is like.

eytl · Post by **eytl** » 06 Feb 2011, 20:05

This is terrible news to wake up to ... my thoughts are with Robert and I hope his injuries are not too severe and that he can make a full recovery without permanent impact on his abilities. It would be a great pity for him to never have a serious crack at a World Championship.

Whilst this is of lesser importance at this time, I agree with the sentiment that this is a terrible blow to Renault. Their radical design was aimed at fast-tracking Kubica towards challenging for wins and the title. Now at the most crucial time in the car's development, the man whom the car should be tailored around is not there to guide the team's direction.

It puts Eric Boullier in an unenviable position too. He has that embarrassing bevy of test and reserve drivers, and whilst Senna is the most likely replacement, again for development purposes they might prefer a more experienced fellow - especially if the car is a gem and they want to find someone to maximise its potential. But what will that say about the purpose of signing a basketball team's worth of reserves and what level of faith Boullier has in them?

Finally, I fear this (along with things like Webber's bike accident last year) will lead to teams starting to place "no participating in other dangerous sports/racing activities" clauses into contracts - which will be a massive shame. As motorsport as professionalised, drivers have stopped dabbling in other series, which is a great shame because in some ways great drivers demonstrating their ability in different types of machinery can only raise the interest in and profile of F1, and give fans more of an opportunity to see their heroes in action rather than just behind the closed doors of the F1 paddock. I know it's a completely different era, but the stories of the likes of Jim Clark and Graham Hill competing in multiple junior categories, touring cars etc - at times all on the same weekend - are legendary.

patrick · Post by **patrick** » 06 Feb 2011, 20:11

Paul Hayes wrote:I remember hearing a - possibly apocryphal - story that Derek Warwick got the Brabham drive in 1986 at least partly because he was the only out-of-work F1 driver who didn't immediately contact Bernie Ecclestone about the drive after Elio di Angelis was killed.

I wonder how cynical the current out-of-work crop, or their managers, have been? I'd be amazed if there hadn't been one or two phone calls to Enstone already, frankly. That's what F1 is like.

I think I once read that managers generally wait a day when something like this happens - but indeed, I'm sure a certain winless german driver's ears have pricked up - and he'd certainly be a better choice than Senna

edit;
great to see fred visiting bob in hospital, it's good to know they are more than just friends in the paddock
http://s3.amazonaws.com/twitpic/photos/ ... UkINijw%3D
http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/9089 ... 602111.jpg

JohnMLTX · Post by **JohnMLTX** » 06 Feb 2011, 20:29

http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2011/02/kubica-rehab-could-be-six-months-or-more/

This is not looking good right now.

The hand has many small muscles, tendons and nerves which if crushed are likely to reduce the ability to roll the fingers in and to make fine movements, such as picking up a pin or in the case of an F1 driver, operate the buttons and dials on the steering wheel. Damage to the nerves will impair feeling and this can take at least three months to return.
As for rehabilitation it is long – maybe six months or more depending on the severity of the crush – and crucially there is no short cut. Sometimes when athletes break a bone they can speed up the repair by sitting in a chamber to boost oxygen or blood flow, but that will not apply in this case.
Here we are dealing with tendons and these must be protected for up to three months before any effort can be put through them, otherwise the tendons rupture again. Also if there is severe damage to nerves in the forearm the ability to make fine movements can be lost.

jpm · Post by **jpm** » 06 Feb 2011, 20:37

http://www.gpupdate.net/en/f1-news/2520 ... risk-over/

However he may not regain full useage of his hand. Hope he's alright in the morning

Ferrim · Post by **Ferrim** » 06 Feb 2011, 20:40

Nice one Fernando.

As for the severity of Kubica's injuries and the rehabilitation time... Several years ago I was playing football (soccer) as a goalkeeper. I jumped to catch a ball which wasn't travelling very fast, and as a result the middle finger of my left hand was slightly injured. It wasn't the first time that it happened to me, and I knew that in a few minutes time I couldn't move it any longer (for a few days) because it would become swollen. Don't ask me why, but I started moving it before it got swollen and, as a result of it, it never fully recovered. Don't worry -it looks perfectly normal and I can move it, but I can't flex it as much as the finger in my other hand.

That happened after a simple hit, with no bone broken, so imagine what could be the result of having a hand completely smashed. Re-constructing it must be incredibly tough, and then it seems logical that it would require several months of being completely unmobilized.

The Passenger · Post by **The Passenger** » 06 Feb 2011, 20:46

From the Italian media, apparently (got this from the Autosport forum, so make of it what you will - the rest of the story was so poorly translated that I won't be posting that):

Robert Kubica will now be recovering at the hospital Santa Corona in the intensive care unit for at least five days. The prognosis, at least for the moment, is absolutely secure. To questions from reporters, addressed to Professor Rossello on the possible return to the track of Kubica, the specialist said: "It is not for me to make, but I can say that for the rehabilitation of the limb will take at least a year"

Apparently the co-driver has also said to the Polish reporters that everything looks good at the moment, but... yeah, this is just something I found on Autosport's message board so it's not the most reliable of information.

Aerond · Post by **Aerond** » 06 Feb 2011, 21:15

patrick wrote:
Paul Hayes wrote:I remember hearing a - possibly apocryphal - story that Derek Warwick got the Brabham drive in 1986 at least partly because he was the only out-of-work F1 driver who didn't immediately contact Bernie Ecclestone about the drive after Elio di Angelis was killed.

I wonder how cynical the current out-of-work crop, or their managers, have been? I'd be amazed if there hadn't been one or two phone calls to Enstone already, frankly. That's what F1 is like.

I think I once read that managers generally wait a day when something like this happens - but indeed, I'm sure a certain winless german driver's ears have pricked up - and he'd certainly be a better choice than Senna

That´s who I´m thinking of, but maybe they will give Senna a shot first. Remember, there´s intensive testing ahead and Senna will probably get into that car, at least for the Jerez test. You can consider that a serious exam to the driver before they make a choice. Maybe Grosjean gets a couple of miles too.

Post by **DemocalypseNow** » 06 Feb 2011, 21:18

The Passenger wrote:From the Italian media, apparently (got this from the Autosport forum, so make of it what you will - the rest of the story was so poorly translated that I won't be posting that):

Robert Kubica will now be recovering at the hospital Santa Corona in the intensive care unit for at least five days. The prognosis, at least for the moment, is absolutely secure. To questions from reporters, addressed to Professor Rossello on the possible return to the track of Kubica, the specialist said: "It is not for me to make, but I can say that for the rehabilitation of the limb will take at least a year"

Apparently the co-driver has also said to the Polish reporters that everything looks good at the moment, but... yeah, this is just something I found on Autosport's message board so it's not the most reliable of information.

Globo is reporting exactly the same thing...

AndreaModa · Post by **AndreaModa** » 06 Feb 2011, 21:19

Yes, I expect Petrov will be getting a lot more mileage than he was expecting now, and Senna and Grosjean will spend time being evaluated, though Senna himself has made it clear that he is the definate number 3 driver, so if we were to go by that, it'll be him getting the nod for Bahrain. I bet he's pissing his pants in excitement! Who could have expected an opportunity like this to come up for him?

patrick · Post by **patrick** » 06 Feb 2011, 21:20

Renault will not, or should not, mess around with several drivers - this is still a crucial season with the new partnership on board and they will need to deliver consistent WCC points even if they aren't going to get what they expected.
which, by the way, will not be Robert - as others have posted, reports from the Hospital suggest promising signs for the recovery of the hand, but the rehabilitation period could be at least a year - if not more than a year to get it to the level of fitness an F1 driver needs.
I think there will be more information on his long term future in a few days once the effects of the operation have subsided a little.

Ferrim · Post by **Ferrim** » 06 Feb 2011, 21:31

It would quite ironic if the Renault is a great car and Senna doesn't get to drive it. Remember he was going to take the second seat at Honda a couple of years ago...

davekartclub · Post by **davekartclub** » 06 Feb 2011, 21:32

When the news was the first item on BBC 5 Live this morning I did fear the worst for a moment; let's hope Robert makes a full recovery. As many polls have pointed out, he is future world champion potential. He may have to be patient, though, with a number of fractures and other injuries to recover from. It could be a long haul.
In the meantime, the thought of a driver line up of Petrov and B.Senna will hardly be what Renault want for their 2011 season to kick off with. If I was them, I'd call Force India and do a deal to take on Sutil.

Phoenix · Post by **Phoenix** » 06 Feb 2011, 21:58

I've been following this all day. Seems thing are quite serious, but the most important thing right now is that he's alive and out of danger. I can only wish a speedy, smooth, steady and effective recovery for him. It would be an horrendous shame if this crash leave him with sequels that ultimately affect his competitivity in F1, which is, sadly, a possibility.

As for Renault's third driver, unless they plump for someone from the outside, it'll be a great opportunity for whoever gets the nod to show his worth in the top flight, in a difficult situation. Let's see how it'll pan out.

The Passenger · Post by **The Passenger** » 06 Feb 2011, 22:01

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEe0084HoT4

Here's an interview with the specialist who operated on Kubica's hand. As was mentioned in the earlier reports, it will take a week to get any definite news on whether the hand will be fully functional and it may take a year for the arm to heal, but at least Robert is alive and still has all his limbs.