Bahrain - What a rubbish place to start a Championship!

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 31 May 2011, 12:03

golic_2004 wrote:http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/91911

Mostly about Bahrain in place of India and India going to December...Brawn says it is unacceptable. We F1 fans could live without Bahrain for a year.

Or many years...

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 31 May 2011, 18:10

DanielPT wrote:
golic_2004 wrote:http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/91911

Mostly about Bahrain in place of India and India going to December...Brawn says it is unacceptable. We F1 fans could live without Bahrain for a year.

Or many years...

Or decades...

Phoenix · Post by **Phoenix** » 31 May 2011, 21:46

dr-baker wrote:
DanielPT wrote:
golic_2004 wrote:http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/91911

Mostly about Bahrain in place of India and India going to December...Brawn says it is unacceptable. We F1 fans could live without Bahrain for a year.

Or many years...

Or decades...

Or forever.

Post by **Londoner** » 31 May 2011, 21:57

Who let Bernie out of the padded cell this time...

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2011/05/31/ecclestone-teams-support-return-bahrain/

Post by **Londoner** » 01 Jun 2011, 11:48

It's news like this which questions why I am a F1 fan. There's now rumours that India might be cancelled to accomodate Bahrain.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/formula_one/13608826.stm

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 01 Jun 2011, 12:00

East Londoner wrote:It's news like this which questions why I am a F1 fan. There's now rumours that India might be cancelled to accomodate Bahrain.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/formula_one/13608826.stm

That would probably mean a contract breach with India and some sort of compensation being paid. Which is very much unlike Ecclestone. And that after giving to such trouble as putting Karthikeyan (read Indian driver) on the grid in time for the Indian GP. Can't really see that happen.

Ferrim · Post by **Ferrim** » 01 Jun 2011, 12:04

After hearing news of this I've decided to create the F1 Rejects "Go home, Bernie Ecclestone" association.

That is, if it doesn't exists already.

dinizintheoven · Post by **dinizintheoven** » 01 Jun 2011, 13:55

It's existed for years... it just needed a name.

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 01 Jun 2011, 15:31

I think I would rather see racing at the unknown Buddh race track for the Indian GP than the guaranteed borefest of Borerain.

Post by **mario** » 01 Jun 2011, 16:26

DanielPT wrote:
East Londoner wrote:It's news like this which questions why I am a F1 fan. There's now rumours that India might be cancelled to accomodate Bahrain.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/formula_one/13608826.stm

That would probably mean a contract breach with India and some sort of compensation being paid. Which is very much unlike Ecclestone. And that after giving to such trouble as putting Karthikeyan (read Indian driver) on the grid in time for the Indian GP. Can't really see that happen.

Unless the occasional rumours that construction of the venue is running behind schedule were true - and the rumours seem to have melted away in recent months - I'd have to agree that it would be very unusual for Bernie to risk breaching the contract and losing so much money, unless the Bahrain GP brought in significantly more than the Indian GP (such that it would pay off the penalty fine for breach of contract and still make a profit).
Joe Saward is currently reporting that the teams held a meeting in Monaco, where it seems that the teams were not happy about going to Bahrain (and would tie in with the comments Brawn made recently about the proposed date being unacceptable). Although officially the line seems to be that the teams are refusing because of the date, it seems that there is also some disquiet about the longer term stability of the country, given the violent repression of the authorities, and concerns over whether their drivers and mechanics would be safe whilst in the country. http://joesaward.wordpress.com/2011/06/01/bahrain-2/

So, it looks like Bernie might have pulled his claims of support from the teams out of his wallet, because it seems that there is little support from the teams in reality.

Bleu · Post by **Bleu** » 01 Jun 2011, 19:08

Bernie was saying that medal system has 100% support from the teams, hence it was introduced that driver with most wins would win the championship. What happened next? Huge opposition by all the teams.

The Passenger · Post by **The Passenger** » 03 Jun 2011, 10:55

Max Mosley warns of PR disaster if Bahrain GP goes ahead

Max basically reiterates what everyone who isn't completely insane (everyone except Bernie, basically) has been saying for a while now.

Max also knows a thing or two about PR disasters (albeit ones that are rather amusing instead of utterly horrible), so maybe he could try to talk Bernie out of this... :mrgreen:

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 03 Jun 2011, 11:01

Ecclestone says that Bahrain call 'nothing to do with money'.

Right... And I am superman.

Post by **Londoner** » 03 Jun 2011, 11:36

Collantine has got some great links, including the viewpoints of Webber and Damon Hill.

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2011/06/03/36/

TomWazzleshaw · Post by **TomWazzleshaw** » 03 Jun 2011, 11:40

There are reports on Sky and Al Jazeera that the race is going ahead. Will look for links.

Ferrim · Post by **Ferrim** » 03 Jun 2011, 11:51

My God, am I just wishing Mosley was FIA president instead of Todt? Am I REALLY wishing it?

Go home, Bernie Ecclestone! And please, Mr. Todt, follow him.

TomWazzleshaw · Post by **TomWazzleshaw** » 03 Jun 2011, 11:53

False alarm. Turns out it was just a tweet from the Bahraini Government Information Bureau or whatever the hell it's called.

TomWazzleshaw · Post by **TomWazzleshaw** » 03 Jun 2011, 12:08

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2011/jun/03/bahrain-government-official-grand-prix

Bernard Charles Ecclestone, you are now obliged to go home. :evil:

Then again I'ld probably wait for the FIA line first.

Post by **Londoner** » 03 Jun 2011, 12:18

Wizzie wrote:http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2011/jun/03/bahrain-government-official-grand-prix

Bernard Charles Ecclestone, you are now obliged to go home.

Then again I'ld probably wait for the FIA line first.

The article is about the tweet from the official, so I don''t think any decision has been made yet. I hope...

Post by **mario** » 03 Jun 2011, 12:26

The Passenger wrote:Max Mosley warns of PR disaster if Bahrain GP goes ahead

Max basically reiterates what everyone who isn't completely insane (everyone except Bernie, basically) has been saying for a while now.

Max also knows a thing or two about PR disasters (albeit ones that are rather amusing instead of utterly horrible), so maybe he could try to talk Bernie out of this...

It's a rare thing when Max is being congratulated in public for being sensible and level headed - the problem is, although Max is probably on good terms with Bernie still, he doesn't have the power of influence of the FIA behind him any more, just his own words. In addition, whilst Bernie might still have a noticeable holding in FOM, CVC are the ones who, owning the most shares in the company, will probably have the final say - and they have remained conspicuously silent on the matter so far.

Now The Guardian has also decided to comment on the issue http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2011/ju ... grand-prix and it seems that the teams are indeed united - united, that is, against going. They don't want to go, it seems, because they do not want to send their mechanics and drivers out to a volatile region - both for employee safety, and financial reasons (such as loss of insurance protection and breaching the rights of their employees to take time off).

Tacitly, though, it seems that the FIA might be helping Bernie out here by moving the final decision date - because the Bahraini government lifted its state of emergency on Wednesday, it means that the teams might no longer be able to cite the clause in the Concorde Agreement that covers "civil strife" that would have allowed the teams to not go to Bahrain.
Because of that, if any team did not show up, it would forfeit its share of the money paid by the organisers, plus forfeit their share of the media rights for that race - a substantial financial penalty, before the issue of compensation comes up. Given that the teams probably could not afford to turn down the entry money - and the cost of reimbursing the media rights would probably bankrupt most of the teams - they seem to have agreed, though, that if FOM and the FIA demand they attend, they will attend, albeit reluctantly.

Ferrim · Post by **Ferrim** » 03 Jun 2011, 12:48

I've just decided that I won't be watching or following at all this FARCE.

I started this as a joke, but now I'm serious. Bernie must go home as soon as possible.

Post by **Londoner** » 03 Jun 2011, 12:58

Absolutely bathplugging ridiculous! :evil:

The sooner Bernie is removed the better. This is going to be an absolute PR disaster for F1, and I hope the teams do boycott.

shinji · Post by **shinji** » 03 Jun 2011, 13:41

This is a new low.

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 03 Jun 2011, 14:11

This is absolute disaster... Obviously they want something to cover and distract people from the protesters and they way they've been handled. I can bear F1 being used as a political and propaganda tool but not when some sort of revolution is going on... Disgraceful Bernie, just bathplugging disgraceful...

patrick · Post by **patrick** » 03 Jun 2011, 15:16

340,000 signature petition here for anyone interested in that sort of thing

sswishbone · Post by **sswishbone** » 03 Jun 2011, 15:41

Can't believe I am typing this but I am with Max Moseley on this, many of the firms will not want to be publicised as endorsing a country where it launched military against protesting people. The teams are also up in arms at the length of this seasons going into december, next season has 21 races so the layover is not going to cut it. I can see a big flare up over this coming

dnhrudi · Post by **dnhrudi** » 03 Jun 2011, 16:33

Motor racing and social justice have never been bedfellows, remember all those South African Grand Prix? If the money talks they will go, and F1 will prove once again that it is the costliest 'cheap' sport in the world. But hey, these guys all live on the planet aircom so why should they care? lets all just give them a big pat on the back the next time they say they are doing something for CHA-RI-TEE, or waving a big banner saying GET WELL SOON JAPAN. :evil:

ADx_Wales · Post by **ADx_Wales** » 03 Jun 2011, 17:18

Jake Humphrey on twitter:

Negative reaction on here about #F1 & #Bahrain. Not surprised. Decision made, we are going, so let us now use the sport to do some good...

I Could write a million words to do with this tweet, but they all begin with F and C.

In regards to te GP happeningl, does anyone else feel cheated?

Yannick · Post by **Yannick** » 03 Jun 2011, 17:33

The pro-Bahrain-GP decision and the Gribkowsky court case make up a good basis to build on for Bernie Ecclestone's ROTY campaign.

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 03 Jun 2011, 17:42

ADx_Wales wrote:Jake Humphrey on twitter:

Negative reaction on here about #F1 & #Bahrain. Not surprised. Decision made, we are going, so let us now use the sport to do some good...

I Could write a million words to do with this tweet, but they all begin with F and C.

Fabulous Championship?

cretoxyrhina · Post by **cretoxyrhina** » 03 Jun 2011, 17:44

Meh.

Bah.

LukeB · Post by **LukeB** » 03 Jun 2011, 18:47

I won't be watching the Bahrain GP. That is all.

Post by **mario** » 03 Jun 2011, 19:15

ADx_Wales wrote:Jake Humphrey on twitter:

Negative reaction on here about #F1 & #Bahrain. Not surprised. Decision made, we are going, so let us now use the sport to do some good...

I Could write a million words to do with this tweet, but they all begin with F and C.

In regards to te GP happeningl, does anyone else feel cheated?

Unhappy, yes, but unsurprised - FOM is run by Bernie and a group of venture capitalists, neither of whom seem interested in letting ethics get in the way of $40 million (which is what Bahrain is paying to host the race). As others have pointed out, Formula 1 continued going to South Africa during the apartheid era long after most other sporting competitions had left, and only stopped going because several governments were trying to prevent their nationals and national teams from going (and in the case of the French government, succeeded in stopping Ligier and Renault attend).

That said, Martin Brundle is perhaps not quite as happy with the decision as some of his colleagues - this is what he had to say on the matter via his Twitter feed:

Read copiously both sides of Bahrain story. Talked to friends+associates who live there. Thought long+hard about it. Mistake to reinstate GP

On a serious level, though, I think that this move will only backfire on the sport - the reaction of the general public has been pretty hostile, with few supporting the decision, and nether the teams or drivers seem happy about the decision. Moreover, I can't see many of the team sponsors being happy about this either, as they definitely did not pay to become associated with this sort of backlash - Joe Saward pointed out that some teams might make a loss on the event if some of the team sponsors refuse to let their logo be used at such an event.

ADx_Wales · Post by **ADx_Wales** » 03 Jun 2011, 20:01

Luke, you arent the only one, and once again I'm tempted to avoid the canadian GP aswell. Last year it was through the stupidity of the guys in charge of the race at monaco, it is the same state of affairs this time, plus with the added bonus of this severe case of greed and lack of humility in not just Bernie Ecclestone, but the entire FOM.

Phoenix · Post by **Phoenix** » 03 Jun 2011, 22:00

Everything I've thought has already been said, so...

shinji wrote:This is a new low.

Indeed.

patrick · Post by **patrick** » 04 Jun 2011, 00:20

If this happens, I think it will be a huge mistake. F1 already feels like it's on rocky ground, there's no need to put more pressure on that. I hope the teams can stand together on this. A lot of people are looking at Red Bull to set an example, maybe this will be their first big test?

AlpineSmuggler · Post by **AlpineSmuggler** » 04 Jun 2011, 02:42

Well, let's stay positive. We can just forget the Bahrain GP!

The actual race can be easily ignored, since by October Vettel would've already secured the WDC, and the track itself doesn't do much in terms of racing or ambiance.

And yeah, supporting role prize goes to FOTA and ultimately the GPDA for sounding that annoying lapdog bark earlier this year, heck, this week and next, and then just going ahead with something that they obviously don't want to do. Prove me wrong, Ross. Or Mark, the man of the few beautifully articulated PR words.

I'd actually love to say I doubted the Bahrain race would take place this year, given several teams' objections, official travel restrictions, and general uncertainty associated with the place. But it does kind of sounds like Bernie came to some kind of backroom/paddock agreement with most of the parties involved. Who knows, maybe the Indians aren't too unhappy about postponing their own GP to give the track a bit more time to get built up.

At least Canada is next.

AlpineSmuggler · Post by **AlpineSmuggler** » 04 Jun 2011, 03:09

ADx_Wales wrote:Jake Humphrey on twitter:

Negative reaction on here about #F1 & #Bahrain. Not surprised. Decision made, we are going, so let us now use the sport to do some good...

I Could write a million words to do with this tweet, but they all begin with F and C.

In regards to te GP happeningl, does anyone else feel cheated?

I guess that'd be a good reason not to follow the pompous douche. Yeah, Jake, you go ahead and use your elite sport to do some good, sure will be changing the political situation in a few countries. Wake up, Jake, this ain't Invictus, you know. Man, what a douche.

... and to answer your question, yes. I feel cheated politically (something F1 really does not need, I think, but then, I don't have Bernie's business acumen). I also feel cheated in a more basic way, where, hey, if a track can't make the schedule, too bad, especially if it's one of the worst tracks on the calendar.

dnhrudi · Post by **dnhrudi** » 04 Jun 2011, 03:36

A certain Jarvis Cocker song springs to mind right now........

AlpineSmuggler · Post by **AlpineSmuggler** » 04 Jun 2011, 05:27

dnhrudi wrote:A certain Jarvis Cocker song springs to mind right now........

Wouldn't be Running the World, would it?