What Tracks Will Get the Boot?

Post by **Ataxia** » 21 Nov 2016, 14:56

Sepang's going at the 2018, which is actually pretty upsetting. One of my favourite circuits.

Jan Magnussen · Post by **Rob Dylan** » 21 Nov 2016, 15:23

Is it just me, or in the last week or so have we had a huge number of tracks announce themselves (or be announced by Bernie) as suddenly provisional or being cancelled in the imminent future? Why do I get the feeling that the ticking time-bomb that is race-hosting fees is about to blow up in F1's face in the next year or so...

- Malaysia: confirmed it's ending in 2018
- Brazil: possibly not being hosted in 2017 - "I wouldn't put my money on it" says Bernie. Organisers saying they think it will happen, but it's replaceable if it doesn't.
- Germany: pretty much no chance of the Nurburgring hosting it, Bernie suggesting the possibility of another Hockenheim deal.
- Singapore: looking to not renew its contract after 2017.
- Canada: rumours of it being removed from the calendar for next year. it's currently still provisional.

If Brazil and Germany get cancelled, that leaves a still-substantial 19-race calendar for 2017, but 2018 is looking at 18 races and 2019 is looking at 17, unless the new owners of F1 can get some fresh tracks on the calendar.

pasta_maldonado · Post by **pasta_maldonado** » 21 Nov 2016, 16:57

Maybe this is a good opportunity to get the season length back down to reasonable levels? 19+ races is quite frankly a bit ridiculous. Hell, even cutting it back to 16 would save the teams millions.

Jan Magnussen · Post by **Rob Dylan** » 21 Nov 2016, 17:36

pasta_maldonado wrote:Maybe this is a good opportunity to get the season length back down to reasonable levels? 19+ races is quite frankly a bit ridiculous. Hell, even cutting it back to 16 would save the teams millions.

Yeah, don't get me wrong, I agree with you that there should be a general reduction in the number of races on the calendar. But under the current ownership of Formula 1, with its desire to have 25 races or whatever per year, it means that a drop in races to 18 or fewer is a sign that they are encountering some serious difficulties getting any of those races on the calendar, which may be good for team costs, but might be a serious sign of overall financial worry for the sport.

sswishbone · Post by **sswishbone** » 22 Nov 2016, 07:44

The whole sport needs a gigantic overhaul, pricing out both the circuits and its fans is beyond stupid.

Malaysia leaving is sad as it is a good circuit. We have the paywall of Sky in UK from 2019, and teams requesting advances. I give this sport until 2025 at best

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 22 Nov 2016, 13:16

I can see future calendars being quite different from year to year as the F1 circus gets hawked around to anybody who can afford it just to maintain the high number of races. Clearly, the standard of the tracks in terms of infrastructure and quality of racing will be compromised but who cares about that providing the money keeps rolling in (in the short term, at least)?

AndreaModa · Post by **AndreaModa** » 22 Nov 2016, 19:10

I think a lot of circuit bosses have seen the new owners come in and fancy re-negotiating their deals. They're testing to see how tough Liberty are going to play. I don't know whether Malaysia are running at a loss with their GP, but let's face it, aside from MotoGP, what else goes to Sepang?

Waris · Post by **Waris** » 22 Nov 2016, 19:28

I fear that if Interlagos disappears from the calendar, it may never come back unless it's drastically renovated (which they don't have money for), since it's considered an out-of-date facility (not by me, but by certain persons) which only remains on the calendar because of its historical value. It would be great for IndyCar, as someone above has suggested, but it's a damn good circuit that frankly I don't want to see F1 leave.

As for Sepang, that is also a good circuit, one of the best out of the newer ones if you ask me. I don't get why the Malaysian guy (was it the Minister for Sport?) is saying that there's no value in F1 for Sepang anymore since it's not new anymore, while he seems keen on keeping MotoGP.

andrew · Post by **andrew** » 22 Nov 2016, 21:59

AndreaModa wrote:I think a lot of circuit bosses have seen the new owners come in and fancy re-negotiating their deals. They're testing to see how tough Liberty are going to play. I don't know whether Malaysia are running at a loss with their GP, but let's face it, aside from MotoGP, what else goes to Sepang?

WSBK and many of the Asian racing series plus TCR.

Post by **Ataxia** » 22 Nov 2016, 22:01

Waris wrote:As for Sepang, that is also a good circuit, one of the best out of the newer ones if you ask me. I don't get why the Malaysian guy (was it the Minister for Sport?) is saying that there's no value in F1 for Sepang anymore since it's not new anymore, while he seems keen on keeping MotoGP.

The race at Sepang was supposed to kickstart the Malaysian motorsport industry by - theoretically - promoting homegrown drivers. Unfortunately, apart from Alex Yoong, Fairuz Fauzy and Jazeman Jaafar, there's been no real drivers anywhere near F1 during the years that Sepang's been on the calendar (currently, Nabil Jeffri is toiling at the back of GP2 and Weiron Tan is focusing on the Road to Indy ladder).

With that in mind, the Malaysian government and backers have decided to draw a line in the sand; there was a time in the early 2000s where they could generate greater value from hosting the Grand Prix, but as they no longer have anyone to act as an ambassador for Malaysian motorsporting interests, then there's no use in forking out millions of dollars every year for a race with dwindling attendances. It's a big shame, but there it is.

Collieafc · Post by **Collieafc** » 23 Nov 2016, 12:36

At least Canada now appears safe for next year:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/38076340

But if organisers are renegotiating/ending their deals, I wonder if F1 will drop back to 16-18 events? Its either that or accept lower rates - simple way to keep the fees up is reduce the bumber of F1 races available.

This Could Be You · Post by **This Could Be You** » 24 Nov 2016, 18:01

According to Motorsport.com, Hockenhiem will not be on the 2017 calendar, thanks to Bernie hiking up the fees for next year to an extent that the Germans cannot afford them.

So what next, Spa or Silverstone? At the rate Bernie's going, there will only be races in America and Asia in the F1 world championship !

(Sorry that turned into a bit of a rant)

Post by **Nuppiz** » 24 Nov 2016, 18:28

This Could Be You wrote:According to Motorsport.com, Hockenhiem will not be on the 2017 calendar, thanks to Bernie hiking up the fees for next year to an extent that the Germans cannot afford them.

So what next, Spa or Silverstone? At the rate Bernie's going, there will only be races in America and Asia in the F1 world championship !

(Sorry that turned into a bit of a rant)

Hey, there's still Azerbaijan to represent Europe! :deletraz:

Dj_bereta · Post by **Dj_bereta** » 25 Nov 2016, 03:42

I'm imagining Vettel saying now: "Honestly! I don't have a home race anymore!"

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 02 Dec 2016, 10:11

Joe Saward is reporting that the French GP will return in 2018 at the mighty Paul Ricard circuit which is good news.

I won't be able to watch F1 by then, of course, as to do so will cost a packet but I'll enjoy the clips on YouTube, I'm sure :facepalm:

Post by **tommykl** » 02 Dec 2016, 10:27

CoopsII wrote:Joe Saward is reporting that the French GP will return in 2018 at the mighty Paul Ricard circuit which is good news.

I won't be able to watch F1 by then, of course, as to do so will cost a packet but I'll enjoy the clips on YouTube, I'm sure

F1i are reporting it as well. The project has the backing of the Provence-Alpes-Côte-d'Azur region and Eric Boullier, and will involve the promoters of the Belgian Grand Prix and the expertise of Monaco in terms of logistics.

I'm feeling cautiously optimistic about these news. It's not set to be properly announced before Monday, and as we know, anything can happen before then.

IceG · Post by **IceG** » 02 Dec 2016, 11:21

Doesn't BE own Paul Ricard?

I wonder what he will charge himeself to host the race?

madmark1974 · Post by **madmark1974** » 02 Dec 2016, 12:29

Here's the rumoured configuration they will be running :

I think that looks pretty decent!

FullMetalJack · Post by **FullMetalJack** » 02 Dec 2016, 14:05

madmark1974 wrote:Here's the rumoured configuration they will be running :

I think that looks pretty decent!

Paul Ricard would be great. I definitely approve of its return.

IceG · Post by **IceG** » 02 Dec 2016, 14:14

That chicane on the Mistral

I remember the piles of German motorcycles in the fence at Signes when the track was opened after the Bol D'Or endurance races.

Enforcer · Post by **Enforcer** » 02 Dec 2016, 18:34

IceG wrote:Doesn't BE own Paul Ricard?

I wonder what he will charge himeself to host the race?

Now, now his family are renting it out and the occupiers will act as the promoters. That clearly makes it completely above board.

Yannick · Post by **Yannick** » 05 Dec 2016, 15:35

It's nice to witness another classic track making a comeback with Le Castellet. That chicane on the Mistral straight does look weird, though.

Post by **Ataxia** » 05 Dec 2016, 16:05

...oh, Le Casselet! I got confused...

UncreativeUsername37 · Post by **UncreativeUsername37** » 05 Dec 2016, 17:18

Yep, it's official: http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/frenc ... ed-857043/

Of course, as we've learned, a lot can happen between a race being confirmed and the date it's actually held, but yeah, this is as "confirmed" as anything can get. I do think they should use one of the tighter first chicanes and have the full Mistral, but oh well.

Spectoremg · Post by **Spectoremg** » 05 Dec 2016, 19:14

Only saw one race at Paul Ricard - the one where the Leyton House cars threatened to do something special.
It looks like a DRS festival.

watka · Post by **watka** » 05 Dec 2016, 20:48

For those wonderig what a lap around Paul Ricard might look like: https://youtu.be/mLyiXG-ZVC4?t=72

Even with the chicane Signes looks pretty cool. Hoping the circuit isn't completely Tilked with hairpin sequences and the like.

Dj_bereta · Post by **Dj_bereta** » 05 Dec 2016, 23:47

Still disappointed to see that Chicane here. I wanted a full Mistral Straight experience!

IceG · Post by **IceG** » 06 Dec 2016, 10:27

Spectoremg wrote:It looks like a DRS festival.

General question. Just because DRS exists, does it have to be implemented at every race/circuit?

Post by **Ataxia** » 06 Dec 2016, 12:37

IceG wrote:
Spectoremg wrote:It looks like a DRS festival.

General question. Just because DRS exists, does it have to be implemented at every race/circuit?

You could go without, but who on earth would want that? People are more than happy to criticise DRS and everything it represents, but without it I guarantee they'd be clamouring for it to return.

IceG · Post by **IceG** » 06 Dec 2016, 13:01

What I meant was, is there a specific rule which mandates one or two DRS zones to be implemented in a given Formula 1 race? Whether it is a good or bad thing is another issue.

Spectoremg · Post by **Spectoremg** » 06 Dec 2016, 17:24

watka wrote:For those wonderig what a lap around Paul Ricard might look like: https://youtu.be/mLyiXG-ZVC4?t=72

Even with the chicane Signes looks pretty cool. Hoping the circuit isn't completely Tilked with hairpin sequences and the like.

Nice vid. Nice engine noise too. They'll have to employ some speed bumps to stop the chicane-cutting shenanegans.

IceG wrote:What I meant was, is there a specific rule which mandates one or two DRS zones to be implemented in a given Formula 1 race? Whether it is a good or bad thing is another issue.

They didn't have one at Mexico did they?

UncreativeUsername37 · Post by **UncreativeUsername37** » 06 Dec 2016, 17:35

Spectoremg wrote:
IceG wrote:What I meant was, is there a specific rule which mandates one or two DRS zones to be implemented in a given Formula 1 race? Whether it is a good or bad thing is another issue.
They didn't have one at Mexico did they?

Pretty sure the main straight had one....

Spectoremg · Post by **Spectoremg** » 06 Dec 2016, 20:03

UgncreativeUsergname wrote:
Spectoremg wrote:
IceG wrote:What I meant was, is there a specific rule which mandates one or two DRS zones to be implemented in a given Formula 1 race? Whether it is a good or bad thing is another issue.
They didn't have one at Mexico did they?

Pretty sure the main straight had one....

Yeah I know, I was kidding - it was such a waste of space.

RonDenisDeletraz · Post by **RonDenisDeletraz** » 07 Dec 2016, 12:40

Glad too see a French race again, always liked Paul Ricard as a track. Back in 1989 Gugelmin and others had that big startline crash, but Leyton House bounced back strongly in 1990 and came very close to a 1-2 finish. Good races back then.

Bleu · Post by **Bleu** » 08 Dec 2016, 19:00

UgncreativeUsergname wrote:
Spectoremg wrote:
IceG wrote:What I meant was, is there a specific rule which mandates one or two DRS zones to be implemented in a given Formula 1 race? Whether it is a good or bad thing is another issue.
They didn't have one at Mexico did they?

Pretty sure the main straight had one....

Yes it had, and then another into turn 4.

To think further, as Mexico City is in high altitude and the drag is lower due to that. Therefore, DRS effect is smaller than what it would be if similarly shaped circuit was somewhere nearer to sea level.

FullMetalJack · Post by **FullMetalJack** » 09 Dec 2016, 19:26

RonDenisDeletraz wrote:Glad too see a French race again, always liked Paul Ricard as a track. Back in 1989 Gugelmin and others had that big startline crash, but Leyton House bounced back strongly in 1990 and came very close to a 1-2 finish. Good races back then.

What makes it even more impressive is that for the previous race in Mexico, neither Leyton House qualified.

Post by **Nuppiz** » 09 Dec 2016, 21:48

FullMetalJack wrote:
RonDenisDeletraz wrote:Glad too see a French race again, always liked Paul Ricard as a track. Back in 1989 Gugelmin and others had that big startline crash, but Leyton House bounced back strongly in 1990 and came very close to a 1-2 finish. Good races back then.

What makes it even more impressive is that for the previous race in Mexico, neither Leyton House qualified.

There's actually a really nice archived news feature about this on grandprix.com: http://www.grandprix.com/ft/ft00039.html

Post by **Londoner** » 05 Jan 2017, 20:36

Yet more murmurings that Silverstone are going to drop the British GP...

Peteroli34 · Post by **Peteroli34** » 05 Jan 2017, 21:25

East Londoner wrote:Yet more murmurings that Silverstone are going to drop the British GP...

It would be a shame if Silverstone had to drop the Grand Prix. but something from the article intrigues me "Two other tracks have contacted us and we are keen to keep a British Grand Prix, there is no doubt about it, we want to have one." What tracks could they possibly be?

Izzyeviel · Post by **Izzyeviel** » 05 Jan 2017, 23:56

Three from Donnington, Brands & Circuit of the Wales