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Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 28 Oct 2013, 20:24
by Liquid
James1978 wrote:Can't see why Massa would want to go to Williams at all, apart from simply to stay in F1 if no other teams want him. And as they're a prestigious name in the sport's history I guess. Lots of parallels with Barrichello in that they were both long-running Ferrari #2s and are
both likely to end their careers with Williams. 
Correction: Both likely for Williams to end their careers.
/tongueincheek
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 28 Oct 2013, 20:26
by mario
Dj_bereta wrote:Maldonado and Grosjean isn't the crashers that they were in 2012. They matured.
I think Perez and Gutierrez is a more crash prone combination in this moment.
It's true that Grosjean has, with the exception of Monaco, improved his performance on track - and his performances have been especially strong in the more recent races, both in qualifying and the race. Perhaps, with the team now putting their two drivers on a more even footing than in the past and therefore supporting Grosjean more heavily, Grosjean is finally able to get the back room support to deliver on track.
As for Maldonado, he has also reigned in some of his aggression - not all of it, as shown in Japan, but I'd agree that Perez and Gutierrez have tended to get into more trouble this season than either of those two.
However, it does raise another difficult question for Lotus - the Enstone outfit has generally preferred a distinct hierarchy with their drivers (we had Alonso/Fisichella and Alonso/Piquet Jr, Kubica/Petrov, Kimi/Grosjean and so forth) and preferred to have a strong lead driver to guide the team. When they split their resources between the drivers, they tend to struggle a bit more and tend to struggle a bit to develop the car in any particular way if they don't have a driver to push them in a particular direction.
Now, my issue with a Grosjean/Maldonado line up would be that I couldn't really see either driver leading the team in that scenario - Grosjean has come across as a bit passive at times and seems to need quite a bit of support from the team to really shine, whilst Maldonado's ability to lead a team has come under question when he has come under pressure from Bottas.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 28 Oct 2013, 21:00
by watka
Although Hulkenberg's performances are more worthy of the Lotus seat, part of me would like to see what Maldonado could do in a consistently strong car. I think its fair to say hes not a slouch behind the wheel and that anyone would struggle with this year's Williams. He obviously thinks a lot of himself which at times is a good treat for a driver to have as self-confidence will help eek out extra pace. I think he could get some good results out of the Lotus, although I'm not sure he's the right cultural fit for the team.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 28 Oct 2013, 21:02
by Liquid
In Maldonado's favour, it's better to coach a quick but reckless driver to be less aggressive than it is to coach a pacifistic but slow driver to be quick.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 28 Oct 2013, 21:04
by Alextrax52
watka wrote:Although Hulkenberg's performances are more worthy of the Lotus seat, part of me would like to see what Maldonado could do in a consistently strong car. I think its fair to say hes not a slouch behind the wheel and that anyone would struggle with this year's Williams. He obviously thinks a lot of himself which at times is a good treat for a driver to have as self-confidence will help eek out extra pace. I think he could get some good results out of the Lotus, although I'm not sure he's the right cultural fit for the team.
Of course that's evident about Maldonado: Remember when he said he'd rather stay at home than pedal the Williams around at the back?
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 28 Oct 2013, 21:16
by Jocke1
Dj_bereta wrote:Maldonado and Grosjean isn't the crashers that they were in 2012. They matured.
I think Giedo van der Garde is more crash prone in this moment.
*altered
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 28 Oct 2013, 21:16
by dr-baker
good_Ralf wrote:And they would be the only pairing on the grid to be both married.
Really? Marriage is that rare amongst the F1 drivers?
Wonder how the marriage rate amongst F1 drivers has changed over the years?
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 28 Oct 2013, 21:22
by Jocke1
dr-baker wrote:good_Ralf wrote:And they would be the only pairing on the grid to be both married.
Really? Marriage is that rare amongst the F1 drivers?
Wonder how the marriage rate amongst F1 drivers has changed over the years?
Only 2 guys married in F1?
I'd be willing to bet that there are only 2 guys
not married, in Nascar. Whole different culture over there.
I watch every Nascar race and the pre-race show, and after the national anthem and "gentlemen" and the fly-overs etc etc, pretty
much every driver hugs their kids and kisses their wife.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 28 Oct 2013, 21:24
by dr-baker
Jocke1 wrote:dr-baker wrote:good_Ralf wrote:And they would be the only pairing on the grid to be both married.
Really? Marriage is that rare amongst the F1 drivers?
Wonder how the marriage rate amongst F1 drivers has changed over the years?
Only 2 guys married in F1?
I don't think he quite means that they are the only two to be married, but that they are the only teammates to both be married.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 28 Oct 2013, 21:30
by good_Ralf
Jocke1 wrote:dr-baker wrote:good_Ralf wrote:And they would be the only pairing on the grid to be both married.
Really? Marriage is that rare amongst the F1 drivers?
Wonder how the marriage rate amongst F1 drivers has changed over the years?
Only 2 guys married in F1?
Massa is married (with a son born in 2009), Grosjean is married (with a son born in 2013) and Maldonado married around Christmas last year, although he is yet to have a mini-Reverend of his own. Raikkonen married in 2004 but I believe he separated from partner Jenni.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 28 Oct 2013, 21:31
by Alextrax52
good_Ralf wrote:Jocke1 wrote:dr-baker wrote:
Wonder how the marriage rate amongst F1 drivers has changed over the years?
Only 2 guys married in F1?
Massa is married (with a son born in 2009), Grosjean is married (with a son born in 2013) and Maldonado married around Christmas last year, although he is yet to have a mini-Reverend of his own. Raikkonen married in 2004 but I believe he separated from partner Jenni.
And Rosberg got engaged as I told you all. We know about Button and Jessica being a couple and Alonso split from his wife last year
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 28 Oct 2013, 22:32
by dr-baker
I don't see Lewis and Nicole getting married any time soon...
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 28 Oct 2013, 22:40
by go_Rubens
dr-baker wrote:I don't see Lewis and Nicole getting married any time soon...
It seems to be a rocky slope for them to deal with... I wonder why.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 29 Oct 2013, 07:35
by James1978
Does Vettel have a woman? I find it very hard to believe he doesn't but if he does then you never see her......
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 29 Oct 2013, 08:18
by CoopsII
James1978 wrote:Does Vettel have a woman? I find it very hard to believe he doesn't but if he does then you never see her......
Hannah Prator.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 29 Oct 2013, 10:37
by Shizuka
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 29 Oct 2013, 11:08
by eagleash
Brawn's departure is not a total surprise but some of the reasoning behind it is slightly illogical IMO. Mercedes say that a single team principle in today's F1 is outmoded given the complexities of the sport. However, someone has to make a final decision surely? Particularly at the race weekends. & it seems to work well enough for other teams. (Although Whitmarsh & Horner have Dennis & Marko lurking & there's also the complicated Ferrari heirarchy). & they are effectively jettisoning a man who has overseen 8 World Driver's Titles.
But where will Brawn go? Perhaps those Williams rumours weren't so unfounded? I don't get the impression that he wishes to retire just yet. & how will Hamilton view the decision? It was said that working with Brawn was one reason why he left McLaren.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 29 Oct 2013, 11:43
by lgaquino
eagleash wrote:Brawn's departure is not a total surprise but some of the reasoning behind it is slightly illogical IMO. Mercedes say that a single team principle in today's F1 is outmoded given the complexities of the sport. However, someone has to make a final decision surely? Particularly at the race weekends. & it seems to work well enough for other teams. (Although Whitmarsh & Horner have Dennis & Marko lurking & there's also the complicated Ferrari heirarchy). & they are effectivelt jettisoning a man who has overseen 8 World Driver's Titles.
But whee will Brawn go? Perhaps those Williams rumours weren't so unfounded? I don't get the impression that he wishes to retire just yet. & how will Hamilton view the decision? It was said that working with Brawn was one reason why he left McLaren.
Well, Merc could just follow the Toyota way and have a boardroom calling all the shots
I'd like to see him at Williams. If only to help them get back up again
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 29 Oct 2013, 11:59
by Ross Prawn
I think Merc are indeed going the Toyota way, or maybe Lauda is bringing his experience of running Jaguar to bear. I can see Merc becoming a corporate run team, ever doomed to to the mid-field.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 29 Oct 2013, 12:44
by eagleash
Indeed, the Toyota "model" seems likely, big global company, with a board that won't delegate. With, as stated above, an ability to under achieve as a result.
It would be great for Williams should he go there but would they be willing to pay him what he is worth, or would he want a stake in the team? But there's hardly a team in the paddock which wouldn't take him on like a shot if they could. Even Red Bull, particularly if the (unsubstantiated) rumours of Newey considering offers from outside the sport have any foundation.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 29 Oct 2013, 14:37
by takagi_for_the_win
Meanwhile...
Nico Hulkenberg has confounded conflicting rumours that he would join Lotus, Force India, Williams or even Ferrari by accidentally signing for all four of them.
‘I don’t know what happened,’ the German driver admitted. ‘You know, people are always putting things in front of me to sign. To be honest, I stopped concentrating a long time ago. Only last month I accidentally signed a table, a spaniel and one of my own legs. So, for sure, it is no surprise that yesterday I accidentally signed completely watertight and legally binding contracts to drive for four different Formula 1 teams in 2014.’
Sources close to Hulkenberg say the under-rated racer is keen to dodge further embarrassment and is now working on a system to avoid letting down his multiple paymasters.
‘Nico is developing a sort of rota,’ confirmed manager Heinz Beenz. ‘So he will qualify, say, the Ferrari and then quickly run down the pit lane and jump in the Lotus and do a qualifying run for them, and so on. Whichever car he gets highest up the grid is the one he will drive on the Sunday and he will tow the other cars behind him.’
Although Hulkenberg’s plan is likely to be extremely tiring and presents a high risk of other cars getting tangled in his complex system of towing cables, the German racer remains upbeat about his contractual over-subscription. ‘Hey, it could be worse,’ he concluded cheerfully. ‘I could have accidentally signed for McLaren.’
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 29 Oct 2013, 15:29
by Liquid
Let's face it, Ferrari could do with Ross Brawn again. Especially when talking about someone having the 'final say'. The Scuderia have been known to get messed up in too many layers in the past. But it's doubtful.
Brawn at Williams would be most intriguing though. Wonder if he could revive their derelict wreck?
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 29 Oct 2013, 15:56
by eagleash
takagi_for_the_win wrote:Meanwhile...
Nico Hulkenberg has confounded conflicting rumours that he would join Lotus, Force India, Williams or even Ferrari by accidentally signing for all four of them.
‘I don’t know what happened,’ the German driver admitted. ‘You know, people are always putting things in front of me to sign. To be honest, I stopped concentrating a long time ago. Only last month I accidentally signed a table, a spaniel and one of my own legs. So, for sure, it is no surprise that yesterday I accidentally signed completely watertight and legally binding contracts to drive for four different Formula 1 teams in 2014.’
Sources close to Hulkenberg say the under-rated racer is keen to dodge further embarrassment and is now working on a system to avoid letting down his multiple paymasters.
‘Nico is developing a sort of rota,’ confirmed manager Heinz Beenz. ‘So he will qualify, say, the Ferrari and then quickly run down the pit lane and jump in the Lotus and do a qualifying run for them, and so on. Whichever car he gets highest up the grid is the one he will drive on the Sunday and he will tow the other cars behind him.’
Although Hulkenberg’s plan is likely to be extremely tiring and presents a high risk of other cars getting tangled in his complex system of towing cables, the German racer remains upbeat about his contractual over-subscription. ‘Hey, it could be worse,’ he concluded cheerfully. ‘I could have accidentally signed for McLaren.’
HWNSNBM has driven every car in every race ever.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 29 Oct 2013, 17:13
by Jocke1
takagi_for_the_win wrote:Meanwhile...
Nico Hulkenberg has confounded conflicting rumours that he would join Lotus, Force India, Williams or even Ferrari by accidentally signing for all four of them.
‘I don’t know what happened,’ the German driver admitted. ‘You know, people are always putting things in front of me to sign. To be honest, I stopped concentrating a long time ago. Only last month I accidentally signed a table, a spaniel and one of my own legs. So, for sure, it is no surprise that yesterday I accidentally signed completely watertight and legally binding contracts to drive for four different Formula 1 teams in 2014.’
Sources close to Hulkenberg say the under-rated racer is keen to dodge further embarrassment and is now working on a system to avoid letting down his multiple paymasters.
‘Nico is developing a sort of rota,’ confirmed manager Heinz Beenz. ‘So he will qualify, say, the Ferrari and then quickly run down the pit lane and jump in the Lotus and do a qualifying run for them, and so on. Whichever car he gets highest up the grid is the one he will drive on the Sunday and he will tow the other cars behind him.’
Although Hulkenberg’s plan is likely to be extremely tiring and presents a high risk of other cars getting tangled in his complex system of towing cables, the German racer remains upbeat about his contractual over-subscription. ‘Hey, it could be worse,’ he concluded cheerfully. ‘I could have accidentally signed for McLaren.’
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 29 Oct 2013, 17:40
by SgtPepper
takagi_for_the_win wrote:Meanwhile...
Nico Hulkenberg has confounded conflicting rumours that he would join Lotus, Force India, Williams or even Ferrari by accidentally signing for all four of them.
‘I don’t know what happened,’ the German driver admitted. ‘You know, people are always putting things in front of me to sign. To be honest, I stopped concentrating a long time ago. Only last month I accidentally signed a table, a spaniel and one of my own legs. So, for sure, it is no surprise that yesterday I accidentally signed completely watertight and legally binding contracts to drive for four different Formula 1 teams in 2014.’
Sources close to Hulkenberg say the under-rated racer is keen to dodge further embarrassment and is now working on a system to avoid letting down his multiple paymasters.
‘Nico is developing a sort of rota,’ confirmed manager Heinz Beenz. ‘So he will qualify, say, the Ferrari and then quickly run down the pit lane and jump in the Lotus and do a qualifying run for them, and so on. Whichever car he gets highest up the grid is the one he will drive on the Sunday and he will tow the other cars behind him.’
Although Hulkenberg’s plan is likely to be extremely tiring and presents a high risk of other cars getting tangled in his complex system of towing cables, the German racer remains upbeat about his contractual over-subscription. ‘Hey, it could be worse,’ he concluded cheerfully. ‘I could have accidentally signed for McLaren.’
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 29 Oct 2013, 21:00
by mario
eagleash wrote:Brawn's departure is not a total surprise but some of the reasoning behind it is slightly illogical IMO. Mercedes say that a single team principle in today's F1 is outmoded given the complexities of the sport. However, someone has to make a final decision surely? Particularly at the race weekends. & it seems to work well enough for other teams. (Although Whitmarsh & Horner have Dennis & Marko lurking & there's also the complicated Ferrari heirarchy). & they are effectively jettisoning a man who has overseen 8 World Driver's Titles.
But where will Brawn go? Perhaps those Williams rumours weren't so unfounded? I don't get the impression that he wishes to retire just yet. & how will Hamilton view the decision? It was said that working with Brawn was one reason why he left McLaren.
I guess that we will have to wait and see how things pan out and whether Mercedes can indeed split the role as envisaged (with Wolff taking on the commercial aspects and Lowe taking over the technical side). I can see a certain logic to their decision but, as others have said, whether they can neatly partition the two roles is another matter.
Mind you, there are certain aspects of Mercedes's decision which is mirrored by other teams - McLaren have split the role of technical director between two people for several years, for example, so there is a precedent for splitting certain roles between two people when it was just one person in the past. To a certain extent, you could even argue that Red Bull kind of runs a similar set up to that which Mercedes are planning - there may be only one designated Team Principle, Horner, but I have the impression that Horner is mostly involved in the technical and sporting operations of the team, with at least some of the commercial aspects of the team organised by Mateschitz rather than Horner. I guess that we will have to see how it works out in practise.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 29 Oct 2013, 23:32
by James1978
If Brawn does leave Mercedes then i can see Hamilton wanting out for 2015 (it's probably too late for him to do anything about '14). Chances are he'll return "home" to McLaren, with the lure of Honda power like his idol Senna had, or if Alonso leaves Ferrari then Hamilton takes his seat there.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 30 Oct 2013, 01:18
by Aerospeed
James1978 wrote:If Brawn does leave Mercedes then i can see Hamilton wanting out for 2015 (it's probably too late for him to do anything about '14). Chances are he'll return "home" to McLaren, with the lure of Honda power like his idol Senna had, or if Alonso leaves Ferrari then Hamilton takes his seat there.
I doubt that Hamilton would even consider going to his dream teams' rival even if he had the opportunity to win championships - a plan to join McLaren-Honda would probably be more likely.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 30 Oct 2013, 01:50
by Rusujuur
James1978 wrote:If Brawn does leave Mercedes then i can see Hamilton wanting out for 2015 (it's probably too late for him to do anything about '14). Chances are he'll return "home" to McLaren, with the lure of Honda power like his idol Senna had, or if Alonso leaves Ferrari then Hamilton takes his seat there.
I think he will wait and see what the next year brings. It was the plan all along really, the fact that he made the right move for this year also was an added bonus. I really think that Brawn has not had that much to do with the actual cars in recent years as some may think so losing him might not change anything for the Mercs and might not bring any actual speed to any other team. Maybe he will retire as he is hitting the 60 mark soon. BTW, the old guard that has dominated F1 since the early 90s are all well over 50 and as I understand next years Ferrari will be at least partially designed by Rory Byrne who is going to be 70 in January...
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 30 Oct 2013, 14:21
by takagi_for_the_win
SgtPepper wrote:takagi_for_the_win wrote:Meanwhile...
Nico Hulkenberg has confounded conflicting rumours that he would join Lotus, Force India, Williams or even Ferrari by accidentally signing for all four of them.
‘I don’t know what happened,’ the German driver admitted. ‘You know, people are always putting things in front of me to sign. To be honest, I stopped concentrating a long time ago. Only last month I accidentally signed a table, a spaniel and one of my own legs. So, for sure, it is no surprise that yesterday I accidentally signed completely watertight and legally binding contracts to drive for four different Formula 1 teams in 2014.’
Sources close to Hulkenberg say the under-rated racer is keen to dodge further embarrassment and is now working on a system to avoid letting down his multiple paymasters.
‘Nico is developing a sort of rota,’ confirmed manager Heinz Beenz. ‘So he will qualify, say, the Ferrari and then quickly run down the pit lane and jump in the Lotus and do a qualifying run for them, and so on. Whichever car he gets highest up the grid is the one he will drive on the Sunday and he will tow the other cars behind him.’
Although Hulkenberg’s plan is likely to be extremely tiring and presents a high risk of other cars getting tangled in his complex system of towing cables, the German racer remains upbeat about his contractual over-subscription. ‘Hey, it could be worse,’ he concluded cheerfully. ‘I could have accidentally signed for McLaren.’
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 30 Oct 2013, 17:51
by Alextrax52
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 30 Oct 2013, 18:35
by Londoner
Cynon shared this on the chat just now. Waiting for a trusted source to pick up on it now...
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 30 Oct 2013, 18:38
by Alextrax52
takagi get those Boullier voodoo dolls at the ready
also where is the chat?
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 30 Oct 2013, 18:42
by good_Ralf
Freeze-O-Kimi wrote:also where is the chat?
client00.chat.mibbit.com/?server=irc.mibbit.net&channel=%23F1Rejects - This is the link.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 30 Oct 2013, 19:01
by Alextrax52
good_Ralf wrote:Freeze-O-Kimi wrote:also where is the chat?
client00.chat.mibbit.com/?server=irc.mibbit.net&channel=%23F1Rejects - This is the link.
Still don't know how to use it
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 30 Oct 2013, 19:04
by good_Ralf
Freeze-O-Kimi wrote:Still don't know how to use it
Enter your username in the box with the name Nick and press the Go button. If you're still not sure, ask someone like pasta_maldonado or Nuppiz.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 30 Oct 2013, 19:58
by mario
We will have to wait and see if it is indeed verified by a more trustworthy source, but it would tie in with rumours that Boullier's attempts to broker a deal to secure the long term future of the team had failed to succeed. Given that Boullier has admitted that Lotus are under financial strain, if Maldonado does still have the support of PDVSA, taking Maldonado might prove to be the necessary price for PDVSA's backing and securing the short to medium term finances of the team. I imagine that there will be quite a few spectators decrying this move if it is indeed true, along with those who may criticise Williams if Massa gets Maldonado's old seat mainly because of Petrobras (though Williams's fragile financial situation may well force the deal).
The other question would be over where Hulkenberg could end up given that most of his first choices seem to have been closed off - Eddie Jordan did claim recently that Hulkenberg is heading back to Force India for 2014, and recently his predictions about the driver market seem to have been pretty accurate. It looks like, for now, Hulkenebrg is effectively stuck making lateral moves around the midfield whilst the same drivers tend to monopolise the top teams.
Rusujuur wrote:James1978 wrote:If Brawn does leave Mercedes then i can see Hamilton wanting out for 2015 (it's probably too late for him to do anything about '14). Chances are he'll return "home" to McLaren, with the lure of Honda power like his idol Senna had, or if Alonso leaves Ferrari then Hamilton takes his seat there.
I think he will wait and see what the next year brings. It was the plan all along really, the fact that he made the right move for this year also was an added bonus. I really think that Brawn has not had that much to do with the actual cars in recent years as some may think so losing him might not change anything for the Mercs and might not bring any actual speed to any other team. Maybe he will retire as he is hitting the 60 mark soon. BTW, the old guard that has dominated F1 since the early 90s are all well over 50 and as I understand next years Ferrari will be at least partially designed by Rory Byrne who is going to be 70 in January...
That is actually something else worth noting - we talk about the driver line ups of most team remaining fairly static but, compared to the career span of most senior designers, the driver line ups fluctuate a lot more frequently than the designers do. A lot of familiar names at most teams have been there for a couple of decades at least, and a lot of teams rely on the same designers a lot more heavily than they rely on the same drivers.
That is one thing that, to a certain extent, concerns me about the struggles of the smaller teams. We have seen that back of the field to midfield teams have offered great opportunities for young designers to make their mark - some designers, like Tombazis, are fortunate enough to come in at a top team from the start, but others, like Newey or Byrne, worked their way up from smaller outfits to the major teams by showing that they could punch above their weight when it came to designing a car.
Where are their modern equivalents? About the only person who seems to have caught the attention of the top teams in the same way is Matt Morris, the former chief designer at Sauber who has since been poached by McLaren - and even then it is perhaps too early to tell whether he will prove to be a diamond in the rough or not. If the teams have become conservative when picking drivers, they are perhaps even more so when picking designers.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 30 Oct 2013, 20:22
by James1978
NOOOOOOOO!!!!
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 30 Oct 2013, 21:03
by SgtPepper
This must be some sort of pathetic, hateful joke.
Re: 2014 Silly Season Thread
Posted: 30 Oct 2013, 22:25
by Ataxia
SgtPepper wrote:This must be some sort of pathetic, hateful joke.
Dear F1 Rejects,
If this story is true, I would like one of you to murder me in a hilarious way so that it's actually newsworthy.
Thank you.