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Re: The Manor Marussia Thread
Posted: 08 Jul 2015, 11:34
by MorbidelliObese
Simtek wrote:AndreaModa wrote:Yannick wrote:
No, it is not Sauber, I'm afraid. They had the words "concept by Mercedes Benz" on their airbox in their first year, running the Ilmor-Mercedes engine, and had been the Mercedes works team in sportscars (Group C) before.
I'd say you'd have to go back to 1991 when Eddie Jordan's team entered, which is now known as Force 1ndia.
But they weren't owned by Mercedes were they? Thus they were a privateer team. But either way, we're talking early 90s for the last privateer team which is sad.
Indeed. "Factory-backed" would be a more accurate term in this instance. Much the same as how Benetton and later Stewart were backed by Ford. Not necessarily a works team, but nevertheless had support from a manufacturer in a way similar to a works team.
EDIT: Thinking about this: Are they the same thing? Because I do remember Benetton being referred to as the "works" Ford team in the late '80s. Is a works team an entrant that is entered under the name of a manufacturer, like Renault or Mercedes? Or does it simply need to have significant financial backing and other support from a manufacturer, like Sauber-Mercedes in 1993-94? Perhaps this belongs in the Ponderbox thread...
Yeah there's kind of three levels between, like in the current field:
1: Mercedes, Ferrari (Toyota, BMW, Renault etc. in the past)
2: Red Bull-Renault, McLaren-Honda (Benetton-Ford, 90s Williams-Renault, Stewart-Ford, Brabham-BMW, pre-2010 McLaren-Merc etc. in the past)
3: Everyone else
In theory there shouldn't be much difference between 1 and 2, in both you're the primary team for said manufacturer, and in most cases not paying for your engine, although obviously designing and building the car and engine under one roof (if not physically, but at least under the same ownership) would help with integration etc.
Re: The Manor Marussia Thread
Posted: 09 Jul 2015, 11:35
by Waris
There is a difference between a works team and a works engine. If a team builds the car and the engine itself, then it is a works team.
If an engine manufacturer that is not also a constructor (i.e. doesn't build a car) supply engines to several teams, but with significantly more support (financial and technical) to one of them, then that team can be said to have the works engine of that engine manufacturer, whereas the other teams with the same engine have customer engines. In the current F1 this distinction isn't really applicable, because Renault is the only engine manufacturer supplying more than 1 team that doesn't have a works team, and I don't really think Red Bull and Toro Rosso get different amounts of manufacturer support, I guess it's about the same. But then again, Red Bull and Toro Rosso are obviously very closely linked.
Re: The Manor Marussia Thread
Posted: 09 Jul 2015, 18:48
by mario
Waris wrote:There is a difference between a works team and a works engine. If a team builds the car and the engine itself, then it is a works team.
If an engine manufacturer that is not also a constructor (i.e. doesn't build a car) supply engines to several teams, but with significantly more support (financial and technical) to one of them, then that team can be said to have the works engine of that engine manufacturer, whereas the other teams with the same engine have customer engines. In the current F1 this distinction isn't really applicable, because Renault is the only engine manufacturer supplying more than 1 team that doesn't have a works team, and I don't really think Red Bull and Toro Rosso get different amounts of manufacturer support, I guess it's about the same. But then again, Red Bull and Toro Rosso are obviously very closely linked.
The situation is a little ambiguous due to the fact that both Red Bull and Toro Rosso utilise Red Bull Technology, so it not quite clear how that support is then fed down into the racing teams themselves. In late 2011, Red Bull Technology signed a deal with Renault where Renault agreed to give them "premium technical co-operation", with RBT becoming the main technical partner whom Renault would work with and develop the V6 turbo engine around.
However, Horner did say that same deal "makes us the premier, factory team of Renault Sport", so it would indicate that Red Bull Racing is probably given a greater amount of support than Toro Rosso are.
Re: The Manor Marussia Thread
Posted: 28 Aug 2015, 23:32
by AndreaModa
Random bit of news I heard a couple of weeks ago from a chap who works at Mercedes - apparently Manor are looking at a return to "Motorsport Valley". Everything left that wasn't sold in the auction was moved back to the traditional Manor base in Yorkshire, but the word is they want to have the F1 team back in a similar location to before. Pity they flogged the Banbury base to Haas...
Still, no shortage of industrial units in the area. Prodrive have only recently moved to a huge great unit just over from where Haas will be, there's a whole estate being built right next to the motorway. And then there's always the poisoned chalice of Leafield which I assume is vacant since Caterham went to the wall.
Re: The Manor Marussia Thread
Posted: 31 Aug 2015, 11:18
by Rob Dylan
AndreaModa wrote:Random bit of news I heard a couple of weeks ago from a chap who works at Mercedes - apparently Manor are looking at a return to "Motorsport Valley". Everything left that wasn't sold in the auction was moved back to the traditional Manor base in Yorkshire, but the word is they want to have the F1 team back in a similar location to before. Pity they flogged the Banbury base to Haas...
Still, no shortage of industrial units in the area. Prodrive have only recently moved to a huge great unit just over from where Haas will be, there's a whole estate being built right next to the motorway. And then there's always the poisoned chalice of Leafield which I assume is vacant since Caterham went to the wall.
For some reason, whenever people mention Leafield I think of a haunted house full of the ghosts of Aguri Suzuki and Christijan Albers wandering aimlessly forever.
Or Ravenholm from Half-Life.
Re: The Manor Marussia Thread
Posted: 16 Sep 2015, 15:15
by Miguel98
http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2015/09/16/alexander-rossi-replaces-roberto-merhi-at-manor/So, Rossi is replacing Mehri for the final 5 races of the season. Sad, just as Mehri was improving. But I guess then, Rossi might get a seat with Manor for next season, which means he's out of contention for the Haas drive.
Re: The Manor Marussia Thread
Posted: 16 Sep 2015, 15:34
by Bobby Doorknobs
>implying Rossi was in contention for the Haas drive
Re: The Manor Marussia Thread
Posted: 16 Sep 2015, 15:54
by Rob Dylan
According to people the 5 races will give him automatic eligibility with superlicence points for next year, meaning there's no issue with him driving next year. Which gives me the opinion he may be driving full-time for Manor next year.
Re: The Manor Marussia Thread
Posted: 16 Sep 2015, 15:56
by golic_2004
Motorsport.com says so as well. Merhi will be at Russia and Abu Dhabi while Rossi contests the remaining GP2 events.
Re: The Manor Marussia Thread
Posted: 16 Sep 2015, 16:00
by AndreaModa
I saw something interesting on Twitter that might explain why he's got the drive:
Re: The Manor Marussia Thread
Posted: 16 Sep 2015, 16:57
by Wallio
AndreaModa wrote:I saw something interesting on Twitter that might explain why he's got the drive:
DING! DING! DING! Luca said time and again that a US team, running customer Ferrari chassis, with a US driver, racing in 3 GPs per year in America, was a must for Ferrari sales. He even talked to Michael Andretti about it. And all of a sudden its slowly happening.....
