Grand Prix Rejects

kostas22 wrote:

mario wrote:Looks like the Italian press, unsurprisingly, have picked up on the suggestion that Force India are thinking of switching to Ferrari for 2014, with Bianchi moving into a stronger position on the back of that deal.
Connected with that rumour, there is another interesting suggestion that we might be seeing more changes in the engine picture for 2014 - it is being suggested that Toro Rosso will be ditching their Ferrari engine contract for 2014 and instead use Renault's turbo engine (and, presumably, the Red Bull KERS instead of the Magnetti Marelli system they use now).
If that is so, and the teams that already have Renault engine contracts roll those over in 2014, we're going to see half the field using Renault engines - that is going to put Renault in a very strong position when it comes to negotiating with the FIA over future engine regulations.

All Italian press except Tuttosport. Which is heavily linked via ownership to Fiat. Either they're staying quiet because they don't want to give the game away, or because they know the rumours won't come to anything.

It could well be that this turns out to be hot air, although the rumours do seem to have the air of plausibility about them - Force India are former customers of Ferrari and we know that the teams will be wanting to spread out the cost of development, whilst Toro Rosso switching to the same Renault engines as the parent team would make sense from a logistics point of view (because common systems could then be integrated into the designs of both cars - even if that could come rather close to blurring the lines of what would and wouldn't count as independent design work by Red Bull Technologies for each team). I guess that we will have to wait and see what comes of these rumours - we should be finding out about Force India's line up for 2013 soon enough.

Benetton wrote:In 50 years I'll believe more people will know who Kimi was than Hakkinen.

If I'm alive in 50 years time (79y), I still will not have forgotten this race:

I know this is off-topic but I can't resist taking onto the Räikkönen/Häkkinen debate.

Believe it or not, I think it's a case of Prost/Senna with the two. Häkkinen was a consistent, fast and a smart driver who rarely put in a great drive, but did it when he really needed to. A la Prost. While Räikkönen is a blisteringly fast driver, relying ore on his raw pace than his strategy or smarts. A La Senna.

Their personalities are somewhat similar to the pair aswell, Häkkinen was more of a PR/Politics type of a guy like Prost, keeping in good terms with the higherups and marketing and the general public while Kimi just wants to drive and leave the media and the public outside, just like Senna.

As for which one is going to be remembered 50 years from now? Speaking as a Finn who witnessed both of them rising to the top... Both will be remembered. 1998 Japanese Grand Prix is a day that I will forever remember. As is the 2007 Brazilian Grand Prix.

DonTirri wrote:While Räikkönen is a blisteringly fast driver, relying ore on his raw pace than his strategy or smarts. A La Senna.

Um, hello, where is Kimi's yellow helmet?

Svenko Wankerov wrote:

DonTirri wrote:While Räikkönen is a blisteringly fast driver, relying ore on his raw pace than his strategy or smarts. A La Senna.

Um, hello, where is Kimi's yellow helmet?

Yes, but what you have to remember is, Hamilton has a far worse personality than both of them. Hamilton cannot take it when things go wrong - take 2011 as a prime exampl - all that cobblers he spouted out didn't fool me. He was just having a strop because Button was faster than him. He acts like a spoilt baby sometimes and that is why I do not like him as much as Button for example. Oh, and his hero-worship kinda thing going on with Senna is delusional fool.

I know the saying, Autosport or it didn't happen.

But rumours are going around that Sebastien Buemi could become Ferrari test driver next season.

I'm wondering whether or not this could happen.

DonTirri wrote:Häkkinen rarely put in a great drive

I would strongly disagree with this. When Mika started winning, 97-01, he put in many, many, many great drives.

I normally don't like to comment on these....but have got to say, that Kimi-Ayrton comparison must be the flatout worst I have ever heard.

Ayrton was a blisteringly fast driver (especially on the wet) who didn't rely on his smart to win, often acted like the track was his and could knock others out.

Kimi, otoh, is not blisteringly fast, at least not since he left McLaren. (See quali performances vs Massa and Grosjean...no, he's just not. Quite fast but not the fastest, especially not on the wet)...he relies on his car control, smarts and good judgement of most situations - and imagining him driving like the other car didn't exist? Emmmmm......

Mika doesn't really find a seat on the overused Prost-Senna comparison axle at all.

TBH, I think that since his comeback, Kimi has been driving like Hakkinen did, i.e. consistently quick, and with an uncanny ability to stay out of trouble (Hakkinens 2001 nonwithstanding)

giraurd wrote:I normally don't like to comment on these....but have got to say, that Kimi-Ayrton comparison must be the flatout worst I have ever heard.

Ayrton was a blisteringly fast driver (especially on the wet) who didn't rely on his smart to win, often acted like the track was his and could knock others out.

Kimi, otoh, is not blisteringly fast, at least not since he left McLaren. (See quali performances vs Massa and Grosjean...no, he's just not. Quite fast but not the fastest, especially not on the wet)...he relies on his car control, smarts and good judgement of most situations - and imagining him driving like the other car didn't exist? Emmmmm......

Mika doesn't really find a seat on the overused Prost-Senna comparison axle at all.

If anything, Raikkonen was criticised, at least in the earlier part of this year, for being overly timid when it came to trying to pass other drivers - there were a number of situation where Kimi arguably had a performance advantage but struggled to capitalise on it by getting stuck behind other drivers.
Moreover, there were times when Kimi admitted that he ended up getting badly lost in his set up work and found it impossible to either work through or drive around a particular problem - the best example being with the F2008, where Kimi told the Finnish press that he kept struggling with understeer with that car, something which he also admitted made him lose some of his confidence and commitment that year.

For the record, I wasn't saying Raikkonen is better than Hakkinen. I was just saying that Kimi will probably be more well known in the future because he seems to have a much larger fan base than Hakkinen had.

I wouldn't compare Senna to Raikkonen either. As some mentioned above, Senna had much better wet weather abilities than Kimi and was also way more aggressive racer. However, my opinion is that in a car set up perfectly on a dry track few can/could match Kimi's raw pace.

And Mika but in some great drives, with Belgium 2000 being his best in my opinion, and not just because of the Zonta-overtake.

If anything, Hakkinen-Raikkonen would be like the Lauda-Hunt rivalry. But then again, Mika doesn't say stupid things like Lauda does.

Grosjean confirmed for Lotus 2013.

Also. Eddie Jordan, who knows this sort of thing, says Marussia have signed Max Chilton to replace Pic.

GwilymJJames wrote:Grosjean confirmed for Lotus 2013.

Also. Eddie Jordan, who knows this sort of thing, says Marussia have signed Max Chilton to replace Pic.

Chilton was already confirmed yesterday.

Not a bad week for RoGro .

Don't screw it up big John!

So 4 Brits on the grid for 2013. Good times.

pi314159 wrote:

GwilymJJames wrote:Grosjean confirmed for Lotus 2013.

Also. Eddie Jordan, who knows this sort of thing, says Marussia have signed Max Chilton to replace Pic.

Chilton was already confirmed yesterday.

EJ getting the hot goss as usual then.

Well three seats still up for grabs. Hopefully Force India will look at that nice Mr Kobayashi, who would probably be a better bet then "Give it" Di Resta

SuperAguri wrote:Well three seats still up for grabs. Hopefully Force India will look at that nice Mr Kobayashi, who would probably be a better bet then "Give it" Di Resta

Are both seats at the Force not confirmed yet (along with one seat at Caterham)? I thought Di Resta was confirmed!

SuperAguri wrote:Well three seats still up for grabs. Hopefully Force India will look at that nice Mr Kobayashi, who would probably be a better bet then "Give it" Di Resta

I fear that this is rather definitive.

We just need Eddie Jordan to 'predict' that Kamui Kobayashi will get one of those Force India seats.

redbulljack14 wrote:We just need Eddie Jordan to 'predict' that Kamui Kobayashi will get one of those Force India seats.

Won't happen, as Kamui's "given up" on getting a 2013 seat. He's saving the donations for 2014 instead.

EDIT: shinji beat me to it...

James1978 wrote:I thought Di Resta was confirmed!

Isn't he confirmed, so?

Sunshine_Baby_[IT] wrote:

James1978 wrote:I thought Di Resta was confirmed!

Isn't he confirmed, so?

Technically, I believe that he is out of contract at the moment (since Force India tends to employ its drivers on a yearly retainer), but the comments from the team appear to have all but confirmed that he'll stay there for 2013 (Mallya's recent interviews about the team have all seen him talk about who will partner Di Resta for 2013).
Talking of Force India, Kamui's comments about abandoning his attempts to get a seat for 2013 suggests that Force India might have already filled their second seat, and with Chilton being confirmed at Marussia, the only other seat potentially up for grabs would be the second seat at Caterham (although I would expect one of the incumbent drivers to retain their seat).

[EDIT] On a related note, it is not just the driver line up that is changing - it appears that there are some major changes going on at Williams too, with their Chief Operations Engineer, Mark Gillan (who is one of the trio credited with overhauling Williams this year) announcing that he is retiring from the team (technically on the 31st December, although in reality he has already withdrawn from the team). http://uk.reuters.com/article/2012/12/1 ... CC20121217
On top of that, it appears that they have also lost Bruno Senna's former Race Engineer, Tom McCullough, to Sauber, whilst their former Strategy Engineer, Mark Barnett, is currently on "gardening leave" whilst he switches from Williams to Force India.

As they days are ticking away and it looks increasingly unlikely that Kovalainen will get a seat for 2013, I'd like to remind roblomas52 that I have an avatar challenge with him. Should Kovy get a seat, I lose and use an avatar of his choice until the start of the 2013 season. But if Kovy doesn't get a seat, he will instead use an avatar of my choice for the same period of time.

Here's the avatar he would be using: Enrico Bertaggia doing his best Venus impersonation back in 1989.

shinji wrote:

pi314159 wrote:

GwilymJJames wrote:Grosjean confirmed for Lotus 2013.

Also. Eddie Jordan, who knows this sort of thing, says Marussia have signed Max Chilton to replace Pic.

Chilton was already confirmed yesterday.

EJ getting the hot goss as usual then.

The Marussia boss announced it to the Russian press on Sunday night (around the time of ROC) - it just wasn't widely reported - no huge scoop from EJ this time.

mario wrote:Technically, I believe that he is out of contract at the moment (since Force India tends to employ its drivers on a yearly retainer), but the comments from the team appear to have all but confirmed that he'll stay there for 2013 (Mallya's recent interviews about the team have all seen him talk about who will partner Di Resta for 2013).

Thanks.

shinji wrote:

SuperAguri wrote:Well three seats still up for grabs. Hopefully Force India will look at that nice Mr Kobayashi, who would probably be a better bet then "Give it" Di Resta

I fear that this is rather definitive.

I love the Engrish in that note

Nuppiz wrote:As they days are ticking away and it looks increasingly unlikely that Kovalainen will get a seat for 2013, I'd like to remind roblomas52 that I have an avatar challenge with him. Should Kovy get a seat, I lose and use an avatar of his choice until the start of the 2013 season. But if Kovy doesn't get a seat, he will instead use an avatar of my choice for the same period of time.

Here's the avatar he would be using: Enrico Bertaggia doing his best Venus impersonation back in 1989.

i know about the avatar challange and i have an avatar for nuppiz when resized

With Kamui off the grid for 2013, this will be the first F1 season in 12 years where there has been no Japanese drivers in the sport. I fear it will be a long time before the next great hope from the land of the rising sun reaches F1...

roblomas52 wrote:i know about the avatar challange and i have an avatar for nuppiz when resized

The chances of any of that being distinguishable once it's resized are very low. The text in the Paul di Resta / milk icon didn't show up either. I'd try again if I were you...

dinizintheoven wrote:

roblomas52 wrote:i know about the avatar challange and i have an avatar for nuppiz when resized

The chances of any of that being distinguishable once it's resized are very low. The text in the Paul di Resta / milk icon didn't show up either. I'd try again if I were you...

I shall pick one tomorrow night which will be funny yet clear when resized

The idea of an avatar challenge is to make someone have a statement/picture they hate.

And if Nuppiz loses, I vote he gets this:

BaconLettuceNinja wrote:The idea of an avatar challenge is to make someone have a statement/picture they hate.

And if Nuppiz loses, I vote he gets this:

Ouch!

I think I have an idea for what could fit as roblomas' "hate" statement...

East Londoner wrote:With Kamui off the grid for 2013, this will be the first F1 season in 12 years where there has been no Japanese drivers in the sport. I fear it will be a long time before the next great hope from the land of the rising sun reaches F1...

The only one I found outside Japan F3 (from which Sutil was the last one to fully graduate into F1) is Yu Kanamaro in Formula Renault 2.0 NEC. He won a race over there and it was his rookie year! There is hope! Although it could take a bit of time to come into F1...

Ok guys, I've been in India for a few days now and I've already established that Mallya and co are in a whole world more of trouble than we first thought. Kingfisher have been grounded for a few months now, the authorities have just rejected their plans to restart operations, and now the lessors are coming in to get their aircraft back. What this means for Force India though is beyond me.

F1's top comedian is back with fresh material:

"I certainly want a podium and then I want to be on it again - that's the target," di Resta explained to The Scotsman newspaper. "But I don't want to luck-in to a podium. For me, it has to be a well-earned top three finish, one which we can build on.

http://www.gpupdate.net/en/f1-news/2889 ... s-in-2013/

http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/nurbu ... spokesman/

Nurburgring is back on the calendar

razta wrote:http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/nurburgring-to-host-2013-german-race-spokesman/

Nurburgring is back on the calendar

It always was wasn't it? This year was Hockenheim so 2013 was always going to be the Nurburgring because they alternate. It still doesn't solve the problem of the empty slot for the 20th race though. Time must be running out for that now.