Grand Prix Rejects

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 13:17**

Wallio wrote:Look at Marussias celebrations at Brazil this year, they had to dump CFD-only build a car the "proper way" and develop it for most of the year. And the result was wonderful. HRT never did any of that. They were just happy to be here.

That's asinine. HRT continuously developed their car and, especially in late early (great description, eh?) 2012, looked much more professional than Marussia, perhaps even Caterham for that matter - with a significantly worse budget and a team base move. To deny that HRT are what this site is made of is ... well, wrong.

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 13:19**

Wallio wrote:Anyway, my point is HRT really didn't fit this sites "preferred MO" and really wasn't a loss.

Despite filling out the registration for the fan club I never received my plastic membership card so I share some of your feeling.

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 14:24**

Wallio wrote:HRT never did any of that. They were just happy to be here. And its one thing to DNQ because your slow, its outright embarrassing to DNQ because you can't build the damn car, ever Andrea Moda put a car together in two weeks. Then to blame customs.......

And Andrea Moda missed the French GP entirely because of a traffic jam that none of the other teams encountered... And Perry might disagree about Andrea Moda's build quality, building the car in a fortnight! Downright dangerous at Eau Rouge.

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 14:29**

Confirmed signing

@clubforce wrote:Sahara Force India is delighted to announce the signing of @SChecoPerez as race driver for the team in 2014 & beyond.

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 14:36**

Yes, Perez in, di Resta out. (BBC)

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 14:36**

YES!

Force India will be the one team I'll keep my eye on! I'm glad Mallya signed Perez - now I just hope the SFI car will be competitive out of the box, or won't be ruined mid-season with tyre/rule changes like this season.

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 14:42**

That's a serious line-up for FI.

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 14:44**

Autosport wrote it as well.

AUTOSPORT understands Perez brings a commercial package believed to be worth around 15 million euro.

That's a hefty sponsorship. Would it mean that Telmex will slightly change the livery of the car as well?

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 15:04**

So, according to Autosport, this is now the current situation:

Code: Select all

Red Bull-Renault      Sebastian Vettel  Daniel Ricciardo
Mercedes              Lewis Hamilton    Nico Rosberg
Ferrari               Fernando Alonso   Kimi Raikkonen
Lotus-Renault         Romain Grosjean   Pastor Maldonado
McLaren-Mercedes      Jenson Button     Kevin Magnussen
Force India-Mercedes  Nico Hulkenberg   Sergio Perez
Sauber-Ferrari        tba               tba
Toro Rosso-Renault    Jean-Eric Vergne  Daniil Kvyat
Williams-Mercedes     Felipe Massa      Valtteri Bottas
Marussia-Ferrari      Jules Bianchi     tba
Caterham-Renault      tba               tba

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 15:21**

Excellent line-up for Force India. Mallya's managed to get one of the most talented pairings on the grid AND extract some pesos from Perez too.

I certainly hope they've got a good car for 2014.

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 15:26**

So Telmex is transferring its money from Sauber to Force India, so Gutiérrez is out of Sauber. Sutil and Pic have a bit of money, so maybe one of them alongside Sirotkin?

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 15:37**

Klon wrote:
Wallio wrote:Look at Marussias celebrations at Brazil this year, they had to dump CFD-only build a car the "proper way" and develop it for most of the year. And the result was wonderful. HRT never did any of that. They were just happy to be here.

That's asinine. HRT continuously developed their car and, especially in late early (great description, eh?) 2012, looked much more professional than Marussia, perhaps even Caterham for that matter - with a significantly worse budget and a team base move. To deny that HRT are what this site is made of is ... well, wrong.

Uh, no, just no, not at all. Faster at times? Sure. But by changing drivers constantly (and not having the decency to at least say the real reasons why), lame-o excuses about "customs issues", running the "This Could Be You!" livery, and admitting to running the same front/rear wings at Monaco and Monza, changing bases EVERY YEAR, and changing owners how many times? (at Marussia is still esstenially Manor) they were never professional at all. They just weren't.

Marussia and Catheram were the pluckily "spend all our bread money to go fast" teams we love. HRT was just.....sad really. IMO of course.

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 15:55**

My prediction for the Sauber line-up: Van der Garde-Chilton, And Kobayashi at Marussia! (he's a works Ferrari driver in GT now, he still has little bit of money, it's all coming together!) Which would mean Sutil will go to Caterham + a yet to be announced driver.

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 16:01**

GwilymJJames wrote:Confirmed signing

@clubforce wrote:Sahara Force India is delighted to announce the signing of @SChecoPerez as race driver for the team in 2014 & beyond.

Does this make anyone else happy? Cause I find myself smiling right now.

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 16:52**

Wallio wrote:Does this make anyone else happy? Cause I find myself smiling right now.

You're a midfield team. You've managed to get a 1.5th-tier driver into your first slot, leaving you to decide between talent and money for the second. But why pick between the two when unsigned is Sergio Pérez? 8-)

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 17:01**

Shizuka wrote:Autosport wrote it as well.

AUTOSPORT understands Perez brings a commercial package believed to be worth around 15 million euro.

That's a hefty sponsorship. Would it mean that Telmex will slightly change the livery of the car as well?

Pls. Current livery of Force India is horrible. Telmex blue and white would be better, or maybe go back to the 2007 colours with Claro sponsorship.

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 18:50**

Wallio wrote:
Klon wrote:
Wallio wrote:Look at Marussias celebrations at Brazil this year, they had to dump CFD-only build a car the "proper way" and develop it for most of the year. And the result was wonderful. HRT never did any of that. They were just happy to be here.

That's asinine. HRT continuously developed their car and, especially in late early (great description, eh?) 2012, looked much more professional than Marussia, perhaps even Caterham for that matter - with a significantly worse budget and a team base move. To deny that HRT are what this site is made of is ... well, wrong.

Uh, no, just no, not at all. Faster at times? Sure. But by changing drivers constantly (and not having the decency to at least say the real reasons why), lame-o excuses about "customs issues", running the "This Could Be You!" livery, and admitting to running the same front/rear wings at Monaco and Monza, changing bases EVERY YEAR, and changing owners how many times? (at Marussia is still esstenially Manor) they were never professional at all. They just weren't.

Marussia and Catheram were the pluckily "spend all our bread money to go fast" teams we love. HRT was just.....sad really. IMO of course.

Mind you, Alonso unintentionally leaked the news that, in 2012, Ferrari ran the same entire rear bodywork package from the Spanish GP to the Brazilian GP - so even more professional and well funded outfits sometimes carry aero pieces for much longer than you think. Moreover, I recall that most teams have pointed out that they put relatively little effort into a Monza specific front wing these days - most of them simply remove the upper cascades at most to maintain the aero balance.

Faustus wrote:So Telmex is transferring its money from Sauber to Force India, so Gutiérrez is out of Sauber. Sutil and Pic have a bit of money, so maybe one of them alongside Sirotkin?

Sutil's name has been mentioned in connection with Sauber in the past, and I could see him being picked as a possible mentor to Sirotkin (assuming that deal is still secure - there have been a few suggestions that Sirotkin's place may not be entirely secure just yet).

Overall, I agree with the sentiment that, on balance, Force India's line up for 2014 looks much more promising now - Hulkenberg should hopefully be back up to speed more quickly this time around now he is working with a familiar team that is keen to work with him and Perez's form, whilst a little weak at the start of the season, did pick up in the closing races. It's certainly fair to say that it's probably the best line up in the midfield, since those two drivers have a reasonable blend of speed and experience, and better than a few front running teams too - what Force India might lack in resources, they could make up for in terms of driver potential.

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 19:35**

How are Sauber's finances looking? Would they be able to afford a decent driver (or indeed, to actually race), without Sirotkin and his roubles?

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 20:57**

Shizuka wrote:YES!

Force India will be the one team I'll keep my eye on! I'm glad Mallya signed Perez - now I just hope the SFI car will be competitive out of the box, or won't be ruined mid-season with tyre/rule changes like this season.

I think FI will have the best-looking car on the grid next year. I do hope it is a solid podium finisher at least so we can see what the Hulk and Checo can do in decent machinery.

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 21:24**

good_Ralf wrote:
Shizuka wrote:YES!

Force India will be the one team I'll keep my eye on! I'm glad Mallya signed Perez - now I just hope the SFI car will be competitive out of the box, or won't be ruined mid-season with tyre/rule changes like this season.

I think FI will have the best-looking car on the grid next year. I do hope it is a solid podium finisher at least so we can see what the Hulk and Checo can do in decent machinery.

I disagree, the Force India paintscheme is quite ugly. The sooner they ditch the Orange and Green the better. But the driver lineup they have for 2014 is very good and if the car is up to it I can see them grabbing 4th in the constructors championship.

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 21:37**

GenEric Blur still exists, and he's revealed what numbers he's applied for.

He wants #27? Not likely. :lol:

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 21:41**

East Londoner wrote:GenEric Blur still exists, and he's revealed what numbers he's applied for.

He wants #27? Not likely.

Does he think he's the next Jean Alesi?

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 21:45**

Freeze-O-Kimi wrote:
East Londoner wrote:GenEric Blur still exists, and he's revealed what numbers he's applied for.

He wants #27? Not likely.

Does he think he's the next Jean Alesi?

So? Will Alesi be in F1 next season? Who has a use for it?

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 21:51**

UgncreativeUsergname wrote:
Freeze-O-Kimi wrote:
East Londoner wrote:GenEric Blur still exists, and he's revealed what numbers he's applied for.

He wants #27? Not likely.

Does he think he's the next Jean Alesi?

So? Will Alesi be in F1 next season? Who has a use for it?

Ferrari...

I'm very glad Pérez got the FI seat. FI will be THE team to look at next year.

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 22:31**

go_Rubens wrote:
UgncreativeUsergname wrote:
Freeze-O-Kimi wrote:Does he think he's the next Jean Alesi?

So? Will Alesi be in F1 next season? Who has a use for it?

Ferrari...

I'm very glad Pérez got the FI seat. FI will be THE team to look at next year.

Yeah, but the numbers are for drivers, so that doesn't matter either.

Posted: **12 Dec 2013, 22:36**

You know, a solid argument regarding this 'number ownership' business, and how eventually numbers must pass on, came in surprising clarity and sincerity from a driver that's not always considered the sharpest tool in the box.

Dale Earnhardt Jr wrote:I always knew that [the No.3 car] would come back. I always felt like one day there would be some kid — and maybe it was Austin [Dillon], I’m sure it was Austin — that started off playing T-ball or baseball or football and Pop Warner, that wore the number 3. Whether he wore it because of their dad or their grandfather, Richard Childress, or some anonymous kid that just liked the number and he used it in everything he did. Eventually, this kid becomes a racecar driver and he wants to be the No. 3. I think that’s fair. He shouldn't be denied that.

In this case, I feel the same way for Austin. I feel like Austin has carried that number as his own. He's made his own impact and legacy with the number. He's won championships and races and used it all his life — ever since he was in sports. It means a lot to him.

Plus, people forget about the history of the number with Richard. It was Richard’s number to begin with — and that’s his grandfather. So there’s a unique storyline with Austin and the number that has nothing to do with Dale Earnhardt.

I think anyone should take any number they like. I imagine some drivers simply won't care which number they'd like, while others may have something specific in mind. If someone wants #27, have at it. It's time to make a new legacy with it.

Posted: **13 Dec 2013, 00:14**

Force India have struck it lucky here. Hulkenberg's first choice was Lotus but he didn't have the cash so FI have pinched him and then Perez came on the market at just the right time, i.e. when Lotus were too far in their discussions with Maldonado to consider Perez. Both drivers will be eager to prove that they can move up the grid so this should be a really good pairing. One slight worry as that Nico is renowned for giving poor, or at least unhelpful negative feedback and Sergio can't have been too much better at McLaren otherwise they'd have kept him, so who's going to help develop the car?

Di Resta seems to be out of F1 and is not interested in any of the available drives. I happen to think he's a better driver than Perez (although Perez has greater overall potential) but obviously no one important agrees with me.

I think Sauber have to go with Sutil + 1 pay driver. Sutil is the only driver available with a decent amount of F1 experience (unless Sauber pull a rabbit out of the hat and rehire Heidfeld or de la Rosa!) and he'll bring some money to the table. That may be enough for Sauber to hold off employing Sirotkin and have a greater choice of second driver.

Posted: **13 Dec 2013, 01:26**

Massively good FI lineup, and nice to see Checco with a seat after being shafted by McLaren. And I predict Hulkenberg will be in his Ferrari by mid season next year, after Alonso has trounced Kimi whose 'back problem' will mysteriously re-appear.

And Di Resta to Indycar, having learned that slagging off your team whenever something goes wrong isn't really a good career move. (Mind you he will earn more than the rest of them put together.)

Posted: **13 Dec 2013, 02:23**

I was thinking about what team numbers I would actually give if I could, and I realised there were some contradictions in my mind. Like 7/8 are spiritually connected both to McLaren and Mercedes to me. But I've finally made my mind up, so here it is:

1/2: Red Bull (14/15 when not champion (13/14 would be better, but that's another story)
3/4: Mercedes (Because they came second in the year before the new system, 3/4 are free, and 7/8 go to McLaren. Like AustralianStig said, I was looking forward to Mercedes with 3 and 4.)
5/6: Williams
7/8: McLaren
9/10: Lotus (had them for 2011-12 and hovering around them otherwise)
11/12: Force India
16/17: Toro Rosso (one below 14/15)
20/21: Caterham
22/23: Marussia
27/28: Ferrari
29/30: Sauber

I probably just stated the obvious, honestly, but I'd be interested to hear any differences people have.

Posted: **13 Dec 2013, 02:37**

UgncreativeUsergname wrote:Yeah, but the numbers are for drivers, so that doesn't matter either.

I realize the rules; I was just trying to be ironic to Ferrari and Ferrari fans.

Posted: **13 Dec 2013, 07:05**

Freeze-O-Kimi wrote:
East Londoner wrote:GenEric Blur still exists, and he's revealed what numbers he's applied for.

He wants #27? Not likely.

Does he think he's the next Jean Alesi?

Better him with an Alesi tribute as anyone else with a sacrifice to the Church of Senna. :evil:

Posted: **13 Dec 2013, 10:38**

East Londoner wrote:GenEric Blur still exists, and he's revealed what numbers he's applied for.

He wants #27? Not likely.

I find it curious that he says he has chosen the number for 2014... Either he hasn't yet realised that the number he chooses now will stay during the whole of his F1 career or he doesn't really believe he will be in F1 after 2014.

Posted: **13 Dec 2013, 11:21**

Massa has just announced via Twitter that his number will be 19 - seems an odd choice but good on him for making something his own!

Posted: **13 Dec 2013, 11:34**

Vettel should have the choice of 12 or 21, depending how he feels on the day.

Posted: **13 Dec 2013, 12:22**

Ross Prawn wrote:Vettel should have the choice of 12 or 21, depending how he feels on the day.

Why not let him decide mid-race, on the final lap even. He could have a sort of rotating one, like James Bonds number plate used to be, and he could flip a switch and it would change depending on his mood.

Posted: **13 Dec 2013, 12:26**

AustralianStig wrote:Massa has just announced via Twitter that his number will be 19 - seems an odd choice but good on him for making something his own!

So long as Sebastian Vettel, Fernando Alonso, Lewis Hamilton, Kimi Raikkonen and Romain Grosjean all decide they don't want no. 19 (excluded Rosberg as he's already chosen his numbers, and Webber as I will be very surprised to see him on the grid). I wonder why he wants no. 19?

Posted: **13 Dec 2013, 12:30**

Backmarker wrote:So long as Sebastian Vettel, Fernando Alonso, Lewis Hamilton, Kimi Raikkonen and Romain Grosjean all decide they don't want no. 19 (excluded Rosberg as he's already chosen his numbers, and Webber as I will be very surprised to see him on the grid). I wonder why he wants no. 19?

I will not be that surprised to see Webber on the grid. After all, he might be invited by Red Bull or any TV to comeback, do a grid walk, watch and comment the ongoing race. After all he is allowed a visit after retiring.

Posted: **13 Dec 2013, 13:22**

I suggested 25 to Grosjean via twitter (the numerical value of R and G). In the unlikely event he actually goes for 25, I'm just putting that out there...

Posted: **13 Dec 2013, 13:27**

I wonder how many drivers are just going to pick the number they would have had anyway. #19 was going to be the second Williams under the old system. And Perez has said he wants #11, which as a Force India driver he would be entitled to anyway.

Posted: **13 Dec 2013, 13:33**

None of them are obviously aiming for the Car Numbers Alternative Championship. :cry:

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