Grand Prix Rejects

"The race for the final seats in Formula One is agoniiiiishingly close! There you can see Pic, Chilton, Van der Garde, Sirotkin and Gutiérrez fighting for the big honours as they all leave the last corner and... and...

...LOOK AT THAT!!"

http://adamcooperf1.com/2013/12/20/koba ... -caterham/

Ferrim wrote:"The race for the final seats in Formula One is agoniiiiishingly close! There you can see Pic, Chilton, Van der Garde, Sirotkin and Gutiérrez fighting for the big honours as they all leave the last corner and... and...

...LOOK AT THAT!!"

http://adamcooperf1.com/2013/12/20/koba ... -caterham/

IF that is true, then .

And just when you thought the Silly Season had raged it's all, this happens. Please Caterham, give Kamui a good car next year.

Please make it happen! I hope it's because Ferrari wants to evaluate future plans after Kimi and Fernando.
(It'd be awesome if Kamui gets to Ferrari in 2015!)

yes to all the above about Kamui!! I think with him in the car if half decent can see a semi 2010 some good results during the season

If it's true, then fair play to Kamui for never giving up on Formula One. I hope that Caterham do actually have a competitive car this season: the team claimed that part of the reason they performed so poorly in 2013 was because they'd already decided to focus on the 2014 chassis.

I don't care how slow the Caterham is. Please let this happen

Basetornado wrote:To be fair about Robin Frigns it wasnt his fault he didnt last the whole GP2 season, sure he wouldnt have won it but he prob needed a 2nd season, but he couldnt because of his budget.
While other drivers like Ceccotto get YDT drives.

There have been some suggestions that Frijns's departure from the team wasn't entirely budgetary related, with a few rumours that he had a poor working relationship with the senior management long before monetary issues intervened.

Ferrim wrote:"The race for the final seats in Formula One is agoniiiiishingly close! There you can see Pic, Chilton, Van der Garde, Sirotkin and Gutiérrez fighting for the big honours as they all leave the last corner and... and...

...LOOK AT THAT!!"

http://adamcooperf1.com/2013/12/20/koba ... -caterham/

If true, that would be a rather surprising decision by Caterham - whilst they've admitted that they have probably paid the price for not having a more experienced driver on hand to guide them this season, the team had indicated in the past that they favoured Heikki given the long working relationship he has had with the team. We will wait and see whether or not it is confirmed - I suspect that, if it is confirmed, that this will be a very popular decision...

Emperor Montezuma has spoken.

Unsurprisingly, he's against double points being awarded...

Can't they just give Kobayashi the Sauber seat (he's done well there after all) and let Gutieerez go to Caterham instead?

I think Telmex are paying more than the 6 million Kamui is bringing in James although out of the teams I'd probably go with Caterham, Sauber to mean are still to unstable financially

East Londoner wrote:Emperor Montezuma has spoken.

Unsurprisingly, he's against double points being awarded...

So now two teams are on public record as saying that they dislike the proposal - it does make you wonder what happened in that Strategy Group meeting that lead to the measure being voted through. After all, we supposedly had a unanimous agreement between all parties when the measure was voted on but an increasingly disunited front since then...

mario wrote:So now two teams are on public record as saying that they dislike the proposal - it does make you wonder what happened in that Strategy Group meeting that lead to the measure being voted through. After all, we supposedly had a unanimous agreement between all parties when the measure was voted on but an increasingly disunited front since then...

I feel bad for the people who only follow F1 by the race broadcasts who'll have to learn about all these rules and political happenings all at once.

Guti confirmed at Sauber.
http://www.sauberf1team.com/en/season/news/detail-view/-/esteban-gutierrez-vervollstaendigt-die-fahrerpaarung-des-sauber-f1-teams-fuer-2014/

Sauber wrote:The Sauber F1 Team is pleased to announce that Esteban Gutiérrez will stay on for the 2014 season, completing the driver line-up together with Adrian Sutil.

Are they pleased? Really? They would rather not be in a situation where they need money over talent.

Sauber wrote:The Mexican first tested with the team at Jerez in late 2009. The following year the talented youngster was signed as ‘affiliated driver’.

Fair enough.

Sauber wrote:2013 saw him in his debut season as a Formula One driver finishing 16th as the best rookie in the drivers’ championship.

In fact, he scored more points than the entire Williams team! This kid is the real deal.

wsrgo wrote:Guti confirmed at Sauber.
http://www.sauberf1team.com/en/season/news/detail-view/-/esteban-gutierrez-vervollstaendigt-die-fahrerpaarung-des-sauber-f1-teams-fuer-2014/

I see that as a mistake. Even if it means useful money.

go_Rubens wrote:

wsrgo wrote:Guti confirmed at Sauber.
http://www.sauberf1team.com/en/season/news/detail-view/-/esteban-gutierrez-vervollstaendigt-die-fahrerpaarung-des-sauber-f1-teams-fuer-2014/

I see that as a mistake. Even if it means useful money.

Me too, but the decision to keep on Sirotkin as a reserve is a good one. He's just a raw talent that needs polishing. This decision should do both him and Sauber, good.

So that's Sauber completed with Sutil/Gutierrez with Sirotkin as tester. This leaves one at Caterham and one at Marussia yeah? With all the craziness of the silly season, it'll be surprising to see GVDG and Chilton retain their seats.

Wait, am I really the sole Guti-fan on this forum? Shame on you all, he's going to whoop Sutil's sorry arse next season!

AdrianSutil wrote:So that's Sauber completed with Sutil/Gutierrez with Sirotkin as tester. This leaves one at Caterham and one at Marussia yeah? With all the craziness of the silly season, it'll be surprising to see GVDG and Chilton retain their seats.

Two at Caterham, to be precise... http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/111493

Id like to see GVDG keep his seat at Caterham but a part of me is also dissapointed that Sirotkin wont be racing. I just wanted him to race to show the world how ridicilous pay drivers can be.

So we've got Chilton, Pic, van der Garde, Kobayashi, Ericsson, Nasr and Kovalainen fighting over the remaining three seats.

Kobayashi - Ericsson at Caterham and Chilton at Marussia?

giraurd wrote:Wait, am I really the sole Guti-fan on this forum? Shame on you all, he's going to whoop Sutil's sorry arse next season!

And Giedo is gonna whip them both...assuming he is on the grid, of course..

Giedo and heikki at Caterham
Kobayashi or Nasr maybe at Marrusia

Nasr is Williams' reserve driver, no?

All I know is that he did okay in GP2 or at least the races I watched.
Pretty sure hes the guy who almost ran over a bird at Monaco and it was all over the internet for a couple of days.

Ataxia wrote:Nasr is Williams' reserve driver, no?

Nothing official about it yet.

My prediction: Giedo and Kovalainen at Caterham and Chilton at Marussia.

I'm glad Gutierrez has been kept on... a season isn't long enough for a driver to really show their worth, especially with next to zero testing these days. He may continue to be mediocre next year, but I think he showed enough flashes that he could surprise and do good things.

my new prediction: Kobayashi at Marussia, Van Der Garde and Chilton at Caterham. You read that good, Chilton will follow Pic's footsteps!
But think of it, a combination Van Der Garde - Chilton looks very good on the financial side...

According to AMuS, Caterham are also considering Glass of Milk and DJaime Alguersuari. Just when you thought the silly season couldn't get any sillier.

fjackdaw wrote:I'm glad Gutierrez has been kept on... a season isn't long enough for a driver to really show their worth, especially with next to zero testing these days. He may continue to be mediocre next year, but I think he showed enough flashes that he could surprise and do good things.

I agree, there is a culture at the moment of binning people after one season if they don't deliver (I'm looking at you Whitmarsh) and it really isn't fair. Not every great driver is great from the word go. If Grosjean had been treated this way he would be long gone by now.

LellaLombardi wrote:

fjackdaw wrote:I'm glad Gutierrez has been kept on... a season isn't long enough for a driver to really show their worth, especially with next to zero testing these days. He may continue to be mediocre next year, but I think he showed enough flashes that he could surprise and do good things.

I agree, there is a culture at the moment of binning people after one season if they don't deliver (I'm looking at you Whitmarsh) and it really isn't fair. Not every great driver is great from the word go. If Grosjean had been treated this way he would be long gone by now.

Grosjean and Perez's situations in 2012 and 2013 weren't exactly analogous. Grosjean had several moments early in 2012 which hinted at his sheer speed; Australia qualifying, Bahrain, Valencia, Canada... Perez really only seemed to have two good races though. Aside from those, he was generally overshadowed by Jenson Button, who is, let's face it, nowhere near Vettel's level. McLaren's goal is to win titles, and regardless of the car, a lineup of Button and Perez is not going to deliver any. Perez is good, I don't doubt that, but he's not the driver McLaren need alongside Button.

Grosjean in 2012, however, had a very solid teammate in Raikkonen, who was clearly extracting the most out of the Lotus every race. And while Grosjean's regression in the second half of the year was very concerning, Lotus already had a clear lead driver, and could afford to keep Grosjean on another year. That is something McLaren did not have in 2013.

Backmarker wrote:According to AMuS, Caterham are also considering Glass of Milk and DJaime Alguersuari. Just when you thought the silly season couldn't get any sillier.

Algersuari is still only 23, so he could fight his way back into F1 if he could get a 3rd driver seat or impress in another major series.

Salamander wrote:

LellaLombardi wrote:

fjackdaw wrote:I'm glad Gutierrez has been kept on... a season isn't long enough for a driver to really show their worth, especially with next to zero testing these days. He may continue to be mediocre next year, but I think he showed enough flashes that he could surprise and do good things.

I agree, there is a culture at the moment of binning people after one season if they don't deliver (I'm looking at you Whitmarsh) and it really isn't fair. Not every great driver is great from the word go. If Grosjean had been treated this way he would be long gone by now.

Grosjean and Perez's situations in 2012 and 2013 weren't exactly analogous. Grosjean had several moments early in 2012 which hinted at his sheer speed; Australia qualifying, Bahrain, Valencia, Canada... Perez really only seemed to have two good races though. Aside from those, he was generally overshadowed by Jenson Button, who is, let's face it, nowhere near Vettel's level. McLaren's goal is to win titles, and regardless of the car, a lineup of Button and Perez is not going to deliver any. Perez is good, I don't doubt that, but he's not the driver McLaren need alongside Button.

Grosjean in 2012, however, had a very solid teammate in Raikkonen, who was clearly extracting the most out of the Lotus every race. And while Grosjean's regression in the second half of the year was very concerning, Lotus already had a clear lead driver, and could afford to keep Grosjean on another year. That is something McLaren did not have in 2013.

Maybe he was Referring to Grosjean in 2009?

This wrote:

Salamander wrote:Grosjean and Perez's situations in 2012 and 2013 weren't exactly analogous. Grosjean had several moments early in 2012 which hinted at his sheer speed; Australia qualifying, Bahrain, Valencia, Canada... Perez really only seemed to have two good races though. Aside from those, he was generally overshadowed by Jenson Button, who is, let's face it, nowhere near Vettel's level. McLaren's goal is to win titles, and regardless of the car, a lineup of Button and Perez is not going to deliver any. Perez is good, I don't doubt that, but he's not the driver McLaren need alongside Button.

Grosjean in 2012, however, had a very solid teammate in Raikkonen, who was clearly extracting the most out of the Lotus every race. And while Grosjean's regression in the second half of the year was very concerning, Lotus already had a clear lead driver, and could afford to keep Grosjean on another year. That is something McLaren did not have in 2013.

Maybe he was Referring to Grosjean in 2009?

Yes, Grosjean in his first attempt, and Gutierrez not Perez.

fjackdaw wrote:

This wrote:

Salamander wrote:Grosjean and Perez's situations in 2012 and 2013 weren't exactly analogous. Grosjean had several moments early in 2012 which hinted at his sheer speed; Australia qualifying, Bahrain, Valencia, Canada... Perez really only seemed to have two good races though. Aside from those, he was generally overshadowed by Jenson Button, who is, let's face it, nowhere near Vettel's level. McLaren's goal is to win titles, and regardless of the car, a lineup of Button and Perez is not going to deliver any. Perez is good, I don't doubt that, but he's not the driver McLaren need alongside Button.

Grosjean in 2012, however, had a very solid teammate in Raikkonen, who was clearly extracting the most out of the Lotus every race. And while Grosjean's regression in the second half of the year was very concerning, Lotus already had a clear lead driver, and could afford to keep Grosjean on another year. That is something McLaren did not have in 2013.

Maybe he was Referring to Grosjean in 2009?

Yes, Grosjean in his first attempt, and Gutierrez not Perez.

My post wasn't directed at you, though.

This wrote:my new prediction: Kobayashi at Marussia, Van Der Garde and Chilton at Caterham. You read that good, Chilton will follow Pic's footsteps!
But think of it, a combination Van Der Garde - Chilton looks very good on the financial side...

If you think about it, they're both very talented as well!

go_Rubens wrote:

This wrote:my new prediction: Kobayashi at Marussia, Van Der Garde and Chilton at Caterham. You read that good, Chilton will follow Pic's footsteps!
But think of it, a combination Van Der Garde - Chilton looks very good on the financial side...

If you think about it, they're both very talented as well!

van der Garde, to be fair to him, put in a stronger performance than you might have expected him to do against Pic - as for Chilton, unspectacular though he may be, is competent enough and has, overall, put in some OK performances against Bianchi.

OK, overall the line up would probably be one where money was the deciding factor, but the teams cannot afford to throw away too much in terms of driver potential given that the battle between Caterham and Marussia could be worth several tens of millions to whichever one comes out on top.
Caterham are currently getting Column 3 payments, having beaten Marussia twice in the past three years, but switching that situation around would see Caterham cut back to just Column 2 payments whilst Marussia would then get the Column 3 payments, a potential swing in revenue of around $20 million (possibly more). With that in mind, and considering that Marussia have a strong driver in Bianchi, Caterham cannot afford to trade off too much in the performance v payment stakes - taking a weaker but wealthier driver could hurt them considerably more in the long term if they lose out in the WCC to Marussia again.

roblomas52 wrote:I remember when me and FMecha both had that as avatar at the same time

I see. Thanks for clarifying. JV's record cover is a cool avatar, too.