Grand Prix Rejects

Caterham did great today but I still wonder what the could achieve with Kovaleinen in the car.

CoopsII wrote:Caterham did great today but I still wonder what the could achieve with Kovaleinen in the car.

Who needs Heikki? Van der Garde is no longer the man we fire ammunition at and is doing a mega job recently

Freeze-O-Kimi wrote:

CoopsII wrote:Caterham did great today but I still wonder what the could achieve with Kovaleinen in the car.

Who needs Heikki? Van der Garde is no longer the man we fire ammunition at and is doing a mega job recently

Thats quite true actually.

I can't believe he said that! I burst out laughing, even though the subject can be sensitive.
Tony Fernandes said yesterday he would HANG HIMSELF if Caterham didn't score any points in 2014.

Jocke1 wrote:I can't believe he said that! I burst out laughing, even though the subject can be sensitive.
Tony Fernandes said yesterday he would HANG HIMSELF if Caterham didn't score any points in 2014.

Not literally, I guess.

But yeah, I found an interview The Guardian had with Fernandes:

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2014/j ... am-f1-quit

Well, I suppose he raises some very valid points. But look for yourself though.

go_Rubens wrote:

Jocke1 wrote:I can't believe he said that! I burst out laughing, even though the subject can be sensitive.
Tony Fernandes said yesterday he would HANG HIMSELF if Caterham didn't score any points in 2014.

Not literally, I guess.
But yeah, I found an interview The Guardian had with Fernandes:
Well, I suppose he raises some very valid points. But look for yourself though.

Yes, literally.
He was being interviewed by Ted on Sky Sports:

-"I still can't quite believe you haven't scored a point for the whole time that Caterham / Team Lotus has been going.
Is this the year it happens?"

-"God knows. If it doesn't, you'll see me hanging around in one of those trees I suppose."
*nodding his head towards the window*

Now I've seen both cars, and ignoring any accusations of judgemental book cover decisions, I'm firmly flying the flag for Caterham once again.

Sometimes in life you have to make a choice, to pick a lane, to choose a trouser of time and so on, and my choice is Caterham for 2014.

Sorry Max fans.

It's really hard no to jump into the Cath wagon since they not only went radical with NoseConeGate, but also got Kamui Kobayashi. Let's see what Cowboy got for this day of pre-season, but we can agree that he'll be miles ahead of TALENT.

4.999s, to be exact. Also a stat, courtesy of Autosport, showing why KK is the real deal:

Kamui Kobayashi, with 53 laps completed, has racked up more mileage today than every Renault-powered team managed across the opening three days of this first pre-season test.

This year he can make cars work, too. Watch out for Kamui!

Ferrim wrote:4.999s, to be exact. Also a stat, courtesy of Autosport, showing why KK is the real deal:

Kamui Kobayashi, with 53 laps completed, has racked up more mileage today than every Renault-powered team managed across the opening three days of this first pre-season test.

This year he can make cars work, too. Watch out for Kamui!

Only problem is that, right now, Bianchi's best lap was about 11 seconds faster than Kobayashi's best time (1m32.2s versus 1m43.1s) - Caterham have only been able to get that mileage by heavily detuning the engine.

mario wrote:Only problem is that, right now, Bianchi's best lap was about 11 seconds faster than Kobayashi's best time (1m32.2s versus 1m43.1s).

Pah! A mere detail.

mario wrote:Only problem is that, right now, Bianchi's best lap was about 11 seconds faster than Kobayashi's best time (1m32.2s versus 1m43.1s) - Caterham have only been able to get that mileage by heavily detuning the engine.

The fact that they managed to do systems check and manage some data was the important thing. You would not suggest that Red Bull is slower than the Marussia, right?

DanielPT wrote:

mario wrote:Only problem is that, right now, Bianchi's best lap was about 11 seconds faster than Kobayashi's best time (1m32.2s versus 1m43.1s) - Caterham have only been able to get that mileage by heavily detuning the engine.

The fact that they managed to do systems check and manage some data was the important thing. You would not suggest that Red Bull is slower than the Marussia, right?

True, I was being mildly flippant in my earlier post and the value of getting some system checks sorted out would be invaluable to the team, whilst Kobayashi has indicated that the team are pleased about getting data on the cooling characteristics of the car that can be used for development.
However, he has also indicated that the problems the team had in Jerez means they are still some way behind where they wanted to be - the only consolation is that Marussia were similarly affected and unable to take advantage in Jerez. http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2014/02/03/r ... kobayashi/

Asides from that, Kravitz has indicated that Caterham were only able to get the car running by running the energy recovery systems in their lowest power configuration, which might limit the usefulness of the test data they acquired.

Kamui Kobayashi says GP2 car faster than his Caterham F1 machine.

Shizuka wrote:Kamui Kobayashi says GP2 car faster than his Caterham F1 machine.

I am a fan of Kobayashi. But: The only thing Koba has done so far is whining, whining, whining. "The car is slow, the engine bad, a GP2 car faster." Sorry to say that, but he should be thankful that he was able to return to F1 without any backing (the 1 million he brought is nothing compared to other drivers). He should just shut up, help his team develop the car and do his job. I still don't understand, how he could turn down the Ferrari offer and drive for Caterham for free!

Zetec wrote:

Shizuka wrote:Kamui Kobayashi says GP2 car faster than his Caterham F1 machine.

I am a fan of Kobayashi. But: The only thing Koba has done so far is whining, whining, whining. "The car is slow, the engine bad, a GP2 car faster." Sorry to say that, but he should be thankful that he was able to return to F1 without any backing (the 1 million he brought is nothing compared to other drivers). He should just shut up, help his team develop the car and do his job. I still don't understand, how he could turn down the Ferrari offer and drive for Caterham for free!

His antics on track in his first F1 period made me question his being in F1. The WEC matured him as a driver, and now he's making himself sound like Kyle Busch when he isn't happy.

Zetec wrote:

Shizuka wrote:Kamui Kobayashi says GP2 car faster than his Caterham F1 machine.

I am a fan of Kobayashi. But: The only thing Koba has done so far is whining, whining, whining. "The car is slow, the engine bad, a GP2 car faster." Sorry to say that, but he should be thankful that he was able to return to F1 without any backing (the 1 million he brought is nothing compared to other drivers). He should just shut up, help his team develop the car and do his job. I still don't understand, how he could turn down the Ferrari offer and drive for Caterham for free!

Because he wanted to race, not a) piddle about in the simulator and b) piddle about at the back of the grid.

go_Rubens wrote:

Zetec wrote:

Shizuka wrote:Kamui Kobayashi says GP2 car faster than his Caterham F1 machine.

I am a fan of Kobayashi. But: The only thing Koba has done so far is whining, whining, whining. "The car is slow, the engine bad, a GP2 car faster." Sorry to say that, but he should be thankful that he was able to return to F1 without any backing (the 1 million he brought is nothing compared to other drivers). He should just shut up, help his team develop the car and do his job. I still don't understand, how he could turn down the Ferrari offer and drive for Caterham for free!

His antics on track in his first F1 period made me question his being in F1. The WEC matured him as a driver, and now he's making himself sound like Kyle Busch when he isn't happy.

It has to be said that his complaints aren't entirely without merit - his comments about the car being 20-30kph slower than the non Renault powered cars on the main straight are, according to unofficial speed trap data obtained by Auto Motor und Sport, completely on the money.

As for the engines being lousy, it is worth noting that, at the moment, Caterham have racked up around 1370km of mileage in Bahrain, which is admittedly nearly double that of the next Renault powered team (Toro Rosso, on about 750km). However, it is still a long, long way short of what the front runners have achieved - Rosberg, the driver with the most mileage, has completed about 940km by himself - and it is worth noting that Mark Gallagher, formerly of Cosworth, has pointed out that Cosworth's target for the V6 engine format would probably be about 4500km of engine mileage, a relatively comfortable margin over the anticipated lifetime requirement to complete 3500km during the course of a race season.

As things stand, only Mercedes, who have racked up just over 3000km in total across the two test sessions and have, across all of their customers, racked up a combined mileage of 10,000km, are on target to meet that goal. Ferrari, by contrast, have about 5,000km of cumulative mileage across the works and customer teams. Renault, by comparison, have just about covered 3,000km of testing mileage - a total that is less than the works Mercedes team and not even remotely close to reaching the validation target that Cosworth would expect most of the manufacturers to be aiming at.
In fact, as things stand collectively all of the Renault teams have not even reached the mileage that a single power unit will have to complete during the entire season, which is unlikely to be a comforting sign for the drivers. He might be rather vocal with his criticism, but at the moment the facts do seem to suggest that his comments are a fairly accurate reflection of the current state of affairs.

But Mario perhaps what this really says is not that the engine manufacturers are under-prepared or have made mistakes, but that instead the amount of testing for a completely new engine formula is woefully inadequate and completely unprecedented.

You'd probably have to go back more than 30 years to find an F1 engine that had fewer miles of testing on the clock than the current crop of units (with the exception of the Life W12 of course).

The fact is the current testing limitations are fine when the formula is kept roughly similar but as soon as something major like engine specification is changed, the teams and the engine manufacturers all find themselves scrambling to cover their arses to avoid too much embarrassment. Hardly the way to conduct the premier single seater championship is it?

AndreaModa wrote:But Mario perhaps what this really says is not that the engine manufacturers are under-prepared or have made mistakes, but that instead the amount of testing for a completely new engine formula is woefully inadequate and completely unprecedented.

You'd probably have to go back more than 30 years to find an F1 engine that had fewer miles of testing on the clock than the current crop of units (with the exception of the Life W12 of course).

The fact is the current testing limitations are fine when the formula is kept roughly similar but as soon as something major like engine specification is changed, the teams and the engine manufacturers all find themselves scrambling to cover their arses to avoid too much embarrassment. Hardly the way to conduct the premier single seater championship is it?

It is true that the pre-season testing has been rather limited given the major change in engine format, but on the other hand it is a decision that the manufacturers and teams all agreed to when discussing the regulation changes for 2014.

I believe that the FIA actually offered the teams the chance to have a fourth pre-season test, but the teams turned it down because of the tight timeframes in the off season for getting a car ready for testing, analysing the data and then making revisions if necessary. It's worth remembering that the last race in 2013 took place on the 24th November and the first test of 2014 took place on the 28th Jan, leaving all of the teams just over two months to prepare the new cars for the first test session.
After all, McLaren and Red Bull only just passed the mandatory crash tests in the week before the first test session, whilst it would appear that the engine manufacturers did not want the test sessions to be packed together too tightly in order to give them enough time to process the data between the test sessions.

As things stand, the teams have had less than three weeks to make it back from Jerez, carry out the necessary maintenance on the cars and turn them around for the Bahrain test, where they are going to remain until the 2nd March (since there is little chance of them getting the cars back to base in Europe and back out to Bahrain in four days). The Australian GP is on the 16th March, although the race weekend effectively starts on Thursday 13th March when scrutineering takes place - given that it usually takes a couple of days for the teams to set themselves up at a track, that means that they need to be in Australia by about the 11th March at the latest.

You could perhaps extend the test sessions by a day at most, but all in all the pre-season testing schedule is actually relatively tight as things stand, such that it might not be easy to squeeze additional testing into the off season. It's perhaps why the teams have opted for mid season testing instead - it isn't ideal, but given the time constraints in the off season, it is the next best thing to have test sessions reasonably early on in the season.

That's true, I'd overlooked the packed schedule. So perhaps really what should have been done is to give the teams more time to prepare and test.

That said, had the testing restrictions not been in place last year, the teams could have used much of last year to test 2014 cars. Or even a test hack of 2014 engines in 2013 chassis to prevent the arms race that used to happen. Ensure all tests were monitored - no new aerodynamic components to prevent teams from using it to improve their 2013 cars and give them some prototype Pirellis and not ones used for race weekends. Limit the tests to the last 6 months of the year and let them loose to get the engines under control in time for 2014.

I think the consensus is clear - more testing. Obviously the troubles that all the engine manufacturers are having (not just Renault, as Ferrari and Merc have had various problems) are a by-product of the strict testing ban. Yes, it may keep the teams even but it results in teams being completely in the dark in the future cars.

Hence, this is why I like circumvention of the rules, like with Ferrari testing their engines in their road cars. I think I posted a video of it on the 2014 Turbos thread a while back.

AndreaModa wrote:But Mario perhaps what this really says is not that the engine manufacturers are under-prepared or have made mistakes, but that instead the amount of testing for a completely new engine formula is woefully inadequate and completely unprecedented.

That may be so, but Mercedes pulled it off. The circumstances being the same for everyone, it's not their fault Renault just couldn't be bothered or just assumed that Turbos were easy when in fact you could arguably say they never got them right the first time around.

Frentzen127 wrote:

AndreaModa wrote:But Mario perhaps what this really says is not that the engine manufacturers are under-prepared or have made mistakes, but that instead the amount of testing for a completely new engine formula is woefully inadequate and completely unprecedented.

That may be so, but Mercedes pulled it off. The circumstances being the same for everyone, it's not their fault Renault just couldn't be bothered or just assumed that Turbos were easy when in fact you could arguably say they never got them right the first time around.

I totally agree. This was supposed to be the Renault pushed regulations, the ones they wanted in order to be more relevant to the road cars. Curious it is that they were the ones to botch it up completely. Although it shouldn't surprise that much since they were the ones that struggled after the last engine regulations changes. In this day and age of ultra professional teams that coasted every rule changes since the test restrictions begun, it was up to the engine manufacturers to deliver. Two did and one did not. Maybe the problem doesn't lie with the current test rules, although I too favour a bit more testing despite, as mario said, teams refused a few more days.

I am sure that Renault will have another "fix reliability/improve performance" dispensation as there exist so few manufacturers that we cannot afford to lose them but, honestly, I am getting quite tired of seeing others being punished for doing their work. You see, Renault proudly advertised each WCC victory they had in the last 4 years despite being far from the best engine to begin with. Because of this and because I am waiting for a season of unreliability levels matching the 80s, it is hard for me to feel sorry for their current predicament.

DanielPT wrote:

Frentzen127 wrote:

AndreaModa wrote:But Mario perhaps what this really says is not that the engine manufacturers are under-prepared or have made mistakes, but that instead the amount of testing for a completely new engine formula is woefully inadequate and completely unprecedented.

That may be so, but Mercedes pulled it off. The circumstances being the same for everyone, it's not their fault Renault just couldn't be bothered or just assumed that Turbos were easy when in fact you could arguably say they never got them right the first time around.

I totally agree. This was supposed to be the Renault pushed regulations, the ones they wanted in order to be more relevant to the road cars. Curious it is that they were the ones to botch it up completely. Although it shouldn't surprise that much since they were the ones that struggled after the last engine regulations changes. In this day and age of ultra professional teams that coasted every rule changes since the test restrictions begun, it was up to the engine manufacturers to deliver. Two did and one did not. Maybe the problem doesn't lie with the current test rules, although I too favour a bit more testing despite, as mario said, teams refused a few more days.

I am sure that Renault will have another "fix reliability/improve performance" dispensation as there exist so few manufacturers that we cannot afford to lose them but, honestly, I am getting quite tired of seeing others being punished for doing their work. You see, Renault proudly advertised each WCC victory they had in the last 4 years despite being far from the best engine to begin with. Because of this and because I am waiting for a season of unreliability levels matching the 80s, it is hard for me to feel sorry for their current predicament.

Then there is also the irony that, in mid 2013, they talked down the idea of manufacturers being given special dispensations to catch up if a manufacturer was behind - comments that now they might perhaps be regretting. It's true that the FIA will probably allow them some room to make changes, and the regulations do permit changes to be made for reliability (but only after those changes are subjected to a public review process), but Renault probably won't be given too many favours given that the other engine manufacturers will probably not want to let them catch up too quickly.

I completely forgot yesterday to celebrate the 1-year anniversary of GvdG's 15th place in Q2.
Seems like everyone else did, too.
For shame

http://www.f1times.co.uk/news/display/08914

Uh oh. Not on the big websites yet but I assume it will be by the end of the day

Rob Dylan wrote:http://www.f1times.co.uk/news/display/08914

Uh oh. Not on the big websites yet but I assume it will be by the end of the day

Well, I pretty sure it's not just the "lack of results". A couple of weeks ago, a news report appeared that it was Catheram that was on delay with the payments to Renault. I wonder what is the current financial state of the team, but it's probably not the greatest.

awful car, but the sale rumours don't see it on any of the main sites

S951 wrote:awful car, but the sale rumours don't see it on any of the main sites

For what it is worth, Bloomberg are now reporting on the rumours that Caterham are being sold off by Fernandes (they seem to believe that Fernandes is selling both the team and the road car divisions). We will wait and see whether the more specialised press picks up on the story, but given Bloomberg is a more significant news organisation, it does seem to suggest that perhaps the initial rumours have some substance to them.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-05-2 ... ports.html

Jocke1 wrote:

go_Rubens wrote:

Jocke1 wrote:I can't believe he said that! I burst out laughing, even though the subject can be sensitive.
Tony Fernandes said yesterday he would HANG HIMSELF if Caterham didn't score any points in 2014.

Not literally, I guess.
But yeah, I found an interview The Guardian had with Fernandes:
Well, I suppose he raises some very valid points. But look for yourself though.

Yes, literally.
He was being interviewed by Ted on Sky Sports:

-"I still can't quite believe you haven't scored a point for the whole time that Caterham / Team Lotus has been going.
Is this the year it happens?"

-"God knows. If it doesn't, you'll see me hanging around in one of those trees I suppose."
*nodding his head towards the window*

So I found yet another instance where Fernandes mentions he will hang himself if Caterham fails to score a first point this year;
CNN interview
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1a496 ... -2014_news
@ 0:10

Q: In terms of 2014, what are your main hopes for the year ahead? Will we finally see a first single point?
A: We've got to, otherwise I don't think I'll be doing this interview much longer. I'll be hanging from a tree somewhere.

When Monaco ended the way it did today, and not really any more realistic chances this year of points, I took the liberty of searching 'round for good suitable ropes Tony could use.
Reliable ropes.
Here are the best ones I have found so far:





I was thinking of e-mailing these to Tony himself or his secretary.
Anyone knows the correct address to send to?

Knowing Caterham, Fernandes will probably mess it up and order twine by accident.

What a mess. If he puts Caterham Cars up for sale as well it just demonstrates what a fool he is. He is full of the talk, the bravado, the bullsh*t if you like, but when things start to turn south, he's out of there just like any other dodgy businessman with a short attention span. The whole Lotus Racing/Team Lotus debacle, which led to him effectively trying to start over by once again buying his way into an iconic sportscar brand in Caterham and piggy-backing on that to market his F1 team - the whole thing is a shambles. If he is prepared to sit it out under the Caterham brand for a decade then I'd have time for him.

These sort of exercises need time - you don't create history, a brand, overnight - it needs time to develop. Look how long it took McLaren to become a recognised force in the sport and therefore by extension, a well-known brand and household name. These things don't just happen by magic which unfortunately I think old Tony was hoping for. He's shown complete ignorance to the workings of F1 and a total lack of respect to several historic car manufacturers and brands. He has left a trail of messy court cases, false promises and damaged icons to achieve what? I feel sorry for the team's employees who were sold on his words and have been led down this path.

I appreciate that Marussia, their Monaco points notwithstanding, haven't done much better, but at least John Booth, Graeme Lowdon and Nikolai Formenko haven't gone tubthumping about how well they will achieve and then hijacked numerous existing brands, only to do sod all for four and a half years.

The fact is, not only has he wasted his time in F1, but he's also ruined Queens Park Rangers as well. They might be fairly successful these days but you'll have a hard time finding neutral fans who prefer them over their opposition on any given day. Everyone that I knew was rooting for Derby County in the playoff final at the weekend.

Sorry Tony but you're a meddling, clueless idiot and the sooner you and your lies bugger off, the better.

Quite frankly, I am becoming more and more ashamed for backing Fernandes in that debacle. I know, Bahar was more like a crazy visionary at the time who was then proved to be just a charlatan who liked to play with other people money when it comes to Group Lotus. Even more crazy was the fact that he managed to drag Enstone from the post crash-gate shambles and turn it into a very good team for the budget they operated under. Anyway, at the time Fernandes just seemed a serious and sensible business man who had clear ideas about where he wanted to go and what he wanted to do. Revive a legendary brand in order to place a profiting car industry business supported by an F1 team which was, at first, used to create brand awareness reaping the success from its operation and then, after the car brand started pumping out solid models, used to market said business. It still looks simple on paper.

Of course, things don't work as easy as that in the real world. It would have been if it was like low cost airline Air Asia, a pioneer in Asia. Fernandes struck gold in that and is apparently nailing it again with Tune Hotels, another pioneer. Sport is another kettle of fish though. In F1, the only two teams which are able to be competitive without having anyone pumping massive loads of money every year or running into red are McLaren and Williams. And they are there for decades. F1 is not for a quick success and Fernandes should have known that. Not even Mercedes managed to grab instant success and they are what they are. Fernandes soundbites do look increasingly what AndreaModa described.

The Queens Park Rangers case was what started to sound the alarms about what Fernandes was and was not. What sensible and serious business man invests in Football, specially in a club without much of a brand? It is all a bit ruinous if one is there to be successful like I think he is.

Now, he wants to off load his F1 team since they failed to grab a point in all their existing time, despite saying he would be in it for serious. Bah, I mimic AndreaModa in wanting to see the back of him. I fear though, for his team...

I remember when the "three new teams" joined F1, Fernandes was praised for going about his entry "the right way", hiring people like Mike Gascoyne to lead the technical team and putting his money where his mouth was.

Five years on, he's failed to instil a "building" culture into the team; he's made wholesale changes to the team every year be it in the driving staff or the technical lineup. Fernandes is more cut out for the reactionary nature of football. Let's be honest, he only bought the Caterham car company so he could have a name for his team.

Nobody's going to fork out £350m for the team AND car company, Tony. Just cut your losses and sell your F1 team to Colin Kolles for a snip. I'd rather have him than you.

One thing I wonder; what will become of the GP2 and LMP2 operations? I'm presuming they'll disappear...

Ataxia wrote:I remember when the "three new teams" joined F1, Fernandes was praised for going about his entry "the right way", hiring people like Mike Gascoyne to lead the technical team and putting his money where his mouth was.

Five years on, he's failed to instil a "building" culture into the team; he's made wholesale changes to the team every year be it in the driving staff or the technical lineup. Fernandes is more cut out for the reactionary nature of football. Let's be honest, he only bought the Caterham car company so he could have a name for his team.

Nobody's going to fork out £350m for the team AND car company, Tony. Just cut your losses and sell your F1 team to Colin Kolles for a snip. I'd rather have him than you.

One thing I wonder; what will become of the GP2 and LMP2 operations? I'm presuming they'll disappear...

I likewise initially supported Caterham given that Fernandes's initial approach looked like he was serious about the project - he sought out experienced staff from other teams, hired two respected drivers (Trulli and Kovalainen) and sought out technical partnerships with Renault, Williams (use of their wind tunnel) and Red Bull that seemed to promise to push the team forward.

However, that promise seems to have burnt out fairly quickly after that - perhaps the rather callous way in which they forced Trulli out was the first sign that things were perhaps not quite what they seemed, given the fact that they didn't even bother trying to defend the decision when they made the announcement. A number of those sponsorship deals which, on paper, looked impressive, seem to have been motivated more by opportunities to leverage the F1 team to advance his airlines (such as the deals with General Electric), whilst the stream of new technical recruits seems to have slowed up in recent years too.

As for their efforts in other series, the LMP2 team already seems to have been cut back - they applied for the 2014 24 Hours of Le Mans, only to then hand their entries back to the ACO less than a day after the entry list was announced. Their plans for a tie up with Renault over the revival of the Alpine brand have also been swiftly abandoned less than 12 months down the line, and I would not be surprised if the GP2 team is soon axed as well.

mario wrote:

Ataxia wrote:I remember when the "three new teams" joined F1, Fernandes was praised for going about his entry "the right way", hiring people like Mike Gascoyne to lead the technical team and putting his money where his mouth was.

Five years on, he's failed to instil a "building" culture into the team; he's made wholesale changes to the team every year be it in the driving staff or the technical lineup. Fernandes is more cut out for the reactionary nature of football. Let's be honest, he only bought the Caterham car company so he could have a name for his team.

Nobody's going to fork out £350m for the team AND car company, Tony. Just cut your losses and sell your F1 team to Colin Kolles for a snip. I'd rather have him than you.

One thing I wonder; what will become of the GP2 and LMP2 operations? I'm presuming they'll disappear...

I would not be surprised if the GP2 team is soon axed as well.

Or they could be bough out by another outfit. Like Motopark/Russian Time/iSport.

Ataxia wrote:Just cut your losses and sell your F1 team to Colin Kolles for a snip. I'd rather have him than you.

Ouch. Saying that back in 2011 would have been a damnable offense (Need I remind anyone of "Collin Kolles GO HOME"?). My, how times have changed...

As might be expected, Fernandes is denying that the Caterham Group is up for sale; however, he has stated that Caterham are looking for investment, perhaps suggesting that something similar to the deal between Sahara and Force India is on the cards. http://www.f1technical.net/news/19381

Rocks with Salt wrote:

Ataxia wrote:Just cut your losses and sell your F1 team to Colin Kolles for a snip. I'd rather have him than you.

Ouch. Saying that back in 2011 would have been a damnable offense (Need I remind anyone of "Collin Kolles GO HOME"?). My, how times have changed...

Come Out Of The House Colin Kolles!