Grand Prix Rejects

GwilymJJames wrote:This is HRT's race.

Freeze-O-Kimi wrote:I must admit that having been so caught up in my Winter Olympics and Biathlon programmes this off season I didn't know that the first race was this weekend. I'll be intrigued to hear what the new cars sound like once the action gets underway

Cynon wrote:You don't know how hard I will laugh if Vettel wins the race...

...or even if Ricciardo wins -- just to rub it in Mark Webber's face.

dr-baker wrote:

GwilymJJames wrote:This is HRT's race.

It's going to be a tight battle between HRT and USF1...

DanielPT wrote:

East Londoner wrote:Just noticed a few weather forecasts for Sunday, and all I say is:

If there is anything GP weather forecasts taught me, is that unless I see rain when time comes, they are wrong. Though this time I was looking forward to see a dry GP so probably, just to piss me off, it will be raining.

Wizzie wrote:

DanielPT wrote:

East Londoner wrote:Just noticed a few weather forecasts for Sunday, and all I say is:

If there is anything GP weather forecasts taught me, is that unless I see rain when time comes, they are wrong. Though this time I was looking forward to see a dry GP so probably, just to piss me off, it will be raining.

The Bureau of Meteorology (Australia's national weather forecasting service, and unlike Meteo France, are actually capable of their job) are predicting rain on Sunday as well. Saturday doesn't look too flash either, for that matter

good_Ralf wrote:

tzerof1 wrote:There hasn't even been a wet standing start since...I wanna say China '06. Which is also somewhat ridiculous.

Britain 2008 was wet at the start IMO. And what a race that turned out to be.

Basetornado wrote:

dr-baker wrote:

GwilymJJames wrote:This is HRT's race.

It's going to be a tight battle between HRT and USF1...

Im willing on StefanGP to cause an upset

dr-baker wrote:However, Andrea Moda will still break down at 1/3-distance (a la Grand Prix de Monaco 1992) having only qualified one car, which would still be better than what MasterCard Lola will manage...

DanielPT wrote:

dr-baker wrote:However, Andrea Moda will still break down at 1/3-distance (a la Grand Prix de Monaco 1992) having only qualified one car, which would still be better than what MasterCard Lola will manage...

Or Lotus. Red Bull could make it past half race though.

Basetornado wrote:

DanielPT wrote:

dr-baker wrote:However, Andrea Moda will still break down at 1/3-distance (a la Grand Prix de Monaco 1992) having only qualified one car, which would still be better than what MasterCard Lola will manage...

Or Lotus. Red Bull could make it past half race though.

Im pretty sure i went down to albert park last week for a bike ride and I rode past some sort of red and yellow racing car limping along

Sublime_FA11C wrote:I hate to dampen the mood but... the greater the hype, the greater the dissapointment. Let's consider for a minute just how huge the chances are we see a crap race instead? Teams will have a lot to fear and little incentive to tempt faith regarding reliability. It's likely the strategies will be conservative as most teams try to last the distance. We may not see any damn racing at all!

If Mercs lock out the front row, what are the odds that Nico and Lewis will do a Mika and David agreement and race each other only as far as the 1st corner?
Pirelli have not had huge amounts of testing and have gone conservative with tyre design. That means a harder tyre. Even though 2-3 stops per race are predicted you can bet many teams will look into the possibility of "preserving" or "managing" tyres enough to pull of a slow and boring but safe 1 stop?

It has already been admitted that "racing" causes fuel to be spent at such a rate that the 100l tank will be dry long before full distance. That means that instead of last year's "tyre management" phase of the race (typically lasting from after the first few laps until after the final pitstop) or even more worryingly, in addition to it "racing" cars will pace themselves to "manage" fuel and ensure they have enough to finish. That's potentialy 4/5th of the race spent piddling around and not racing. ERS batteries will not really help. The batteries themselves will need charging time, so a period of blistering pace and overtaking will certainly have to be followed by a period of patient and sensible "management". This is not really new, drivers allways had to make sure not to wear out their machines too much before the end, however i'm more concerned that with the benefit of telemetry, engineers might come up with solutions that "manage" tyres, fuel and equipment in such a way as to kill racing dead. Beacuse racing is detrimental to reliability... Nico Rosberg's comments after the Bahrain test suggest that Mercedes is chasing 100% bulletproof reliability and is not there yet.

I can sympathise with Merc and other team engineers, but i do not want 100% bulletproof F1. Bulletproof F1 sucks, regardless whoose finger is raised in victory. Racing, excitement and drama make a good championship season, but those are complete opposites of professional and engineering principles that guide current era F1 teams to succes. They want predictability and clinical reliability. They don't care how good Brasil 2013 was (Nobody knew how to drive or setup the car because weather interrupted all sessions before the race). They would much rather be 110% prepared and rob us of any potential for excitement to slip out of their control.

Screw it i am a pessimist right now. I wish i wasn't but i don't see 2014 being much better than 2013. Most of the time we were fortunate to enjoy decent races in 2013, even on traditionally boring tracks. The championship was sewn up after the tyre change, but prior to that and even after, there were a few teams/drivers out to prove a point or chase down points or at least try to race. But far too often races got bogged down in the "management phase". Aerodynamic wake is still a major obstacle to cars following one another closely. It makes it less likely we see non DRS overtakes or drivers pressuring one another into errors, though i suspect Raikkonnen will try it. He allways does.

I am excited about the new stuff and the general reshuffle, but i very much doubt the racing will improve unless engineers compute that giving greater control over strategy to drivers themselves would improve their chances. While i'm not disillusioned or unhappy with F1 in general, i do think we should prepare for some terribly dull "racing" ahead. Though i secretly hope teams throw their strategy books in the bins and take risks.

AdrianSutil wrote:Firstly, tzerof1 is spot-on with the engine sounds, i thought the exact same back in Jerez. secondly, Ive met a girl and its all going splendid thank you very much, but she wants me to stay at hers on Saturday, which leaves me with a dilemma: stay at hers and have a jolly good time but miss my first 'live watching' Australian GP since 2009 and before that, 1997. SkyPlus to the rescue!!

And i really don't want rain this weekend, I want to see who is competitive from the get-go.

Wallio wrote:

AdrianSutil wrote:Firstly, tzerof1 is spot-on with the engine sounds, i thought the exact same back in Jerez. secondly, Ive met a girl and its all going splendid thank you very much, but she wants me to stay at hers on Saturday, which leaves me with a dilemma: stay at hers and have a jolly good time but miss my first 'live watching' Australian GP since 2009 and before that, 1997. SkyPlus to the rescue!!

And i really don't want rain this weekend, I want to see who is competitive from the get-go.

If she doesn't like F1, she's not a keeper!

IceG wrote:Hamilton left a leading team to go to an underperforming one because he could see the writing on the wall. Vettel has stayed with a dominant team despite the history of Renault's struggles with turbos and Newey's dislike of hot engines, he did not see what was coming.

Vettel has won championship after championship. Hamilton hasn't.

That is why vettelwinslol is boring and hamiltonwinslolo isn't (yet).

AdrianSutil wrote:I've met a girl and its all going splendid thank you very much, but she wants me to stay at hers on Saturday, which leaves me with a dilemma: stay at hers and have a jolly good time but miss my first 'live watching' Australian GP since 2009 and before that, 1997.

watka wrote:

Sublime_FA11C wrote:I hate to dampen the mood but... the greater the hype, the greater the dissapointment. Let's consider for a minute just how huge the chances are we see a crap race instead? Teams will have a lot to fear and little incentive to tempt faith regarding reliability. It's likely the strategies will be conservative as most teams try to last the distance. We may not see any damn racing at all!

If Mercs lock out the front row, what are the odds that Nico and Lewis will do a Mika and David agreement and race each other only as far as the 1st corner?
Pirelli have not had huge amounts of testing and have gone conservative with tyre design. That means a harder tyre. Even though 2-3 stops per race are predicted you can bet many teams will look into the possibility of "preserving" or "managing" tyres enough to pull of a slow and boring but safe 1 stop?

It has already been admitted that "racing" causes fuel to be spent at such a rate that the 100l tank will be dry long before full distance. That means that instead of last year's "tyre management" phase of the race (typically lasting from after the first few laps until after the final pitstop) or even more worryingly, in addition to it "racing" cars will pace themselves to "manage" fuel and ensure they have enough to finish. That's potentialy 4/5th of the race spent piddling around and not racing. ERS batteries will not really help. The batteries themselves will need charging time, so a period of blistering pace and overtaking will certainly have to be followed by a period of patient and sensible "management". This is not really new, drivers allways had to make sure not to wear out their machines too much before the end, however i'm more concerned that with the benefit of telemetry, engineers might come up with solutions that "manage" tyres, fuel and equipment in such a way as to kill racing dead. Beacuse racing is detrimental to reliability... Nico Rosberg's comments after the Bahrain test suggest that Mercedes is chasing 100% bulletproof reliability and is not there yet.

I can sympathise with Merc and other team engineers, but i do not want 100% bulletproof F1. Bulletproof F1 sucks, regardless whoose finger is raised in victory. Racing, excitement and drama make a good championship season, but those are complete opposites of professional and engineering principles that guide current era F1 teams to succes. They want predictability and clinical reliability. They don't care how good Brasil 2013 was (Nobody knew how to drive or setup the car because weather interrupted all sessions before the race). They would much rather be 110% prepared and rob us of any potential for excitement to slip out of their control.

Screw it i am a pessimist right now. I wish i wasn't but i don't see 2014 being much better than 2013. Most of the time we were fortunate to enjoy decent races in 2013, even on traditionally boring tracks. The championship was sewn up after the tyre change, but prior to that and even after, there were a few teams/drivers out to prove a point or chase down points or at least try to race. But far too often races got bogged down in the "management phase". Aerodynamic wake is still a major obstacle to cars following one another closely. It makes it less likely we see non DRS overtakes or drivers pressuring one another into errors, though i suspect Raikkonnen will try it. He allways does.

I am excited about the new stuff and the general reshuffle, but i very much doubt the racing will improve unless engineers compute that giving greater control over strategy to drivers themselves would improve their chances. While i'm not disillusioned or unhappy with F1 in general, i do think we should prepare for some terribly dull "racing" ahead. Though i secretly hope teams throw their strategy books in the bins and take risks.

I hate to admit it, but you could well be right. I myself am optimistic and I think if the grid is as jumbled (compared to last season) they'll be teams wanting the win to get ahead in the championship (read Mercedes, Ferrari) or for long-awaited glory (read Williams, Force India) and they'll be a few risks taken at Oz. Going on from there though, I imagine that the teams will learn a lot quite quickly and it may well turn into a battle of the statisticians/analysts who are micro-managing the drivers' races for them.

I haven't heard a lot on the fuel situation, but I guess it may be a factor. The tyre situation though I imagine will be much the same. Would I be right or wrong in saying that the extra torque of the engines may stress the tyres more?

Wallio wrote:I'm not so interested in the race per say. Qualifying is what I want to see. We have yet to see these new cars at full bore. I want to see how quick they really are. Especially since we won't have to worry about who's on what fuel load.

And there's rumors going around that Red Bull are working flat out on "a whole new car" for Spain. But chassis are locked-in no? So will it be everything save the monococque? Or is it just BS?

mario wrote:Hard to say to be honest - it is true that, normally, the chassis is homologated before the season (unless there are major defects which require rehomologation of a new design on safety grounds, but that is very tightly controlled). Other parts, such as the side and rear impact structures, gearbox casing etc. are also tightly controlled and therefore probably can't be changed; however, that would still potentially allow them to modify the rear bodywork and, in addition, the internal packaging of the car could be refined (the changes needn't all be on the surface). It's probably best to take the rumours with a pinch of salt for now though - I'd expect a refinement for the Spanish GP, but I don't think that the changes will be quite as dramatic as a "whole new car".

Basetornado wrote:

dr-baker wrote:

GwilymJJames wrote:This is HRT's race.

It's going to be a tight battle between HRT and USF1...

Im willing on StefanGP to cause an upset

Enforcer wrote:

IceG wrote:Hamilton left a leading team to go to an underperforming one because he could see the writing on the wall. Vettel has stayed with a dominant team despite the history of Renault's struggles with turbos and Newey's dislike of hot engines, he did not see what was coming.

Vettel has won championship after championship. Hamilton hasn't.

That is why vettelwinslol is boring and hamiltonwinslolo isn't (yet).

Holds no ice for me, mate. If we get hamiltonwinslol instead of vettelwinslol the spectacle will be just as boring just as fast. Unless you are a Hamilton fan, the only difference will be the annoyance of the The Finger post-race being replaced by the annoyance of Sky & the BBC's 'boffins' discussing whether or not Hamilton is the reincarnation of Senna post-race.

Aerospeed wrote:Now who's that bloke on the right?

giraurd wrote:Melbourne 2010 as well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X-TweBGLFYY

go_Rubens wrote:

Enforcer wrote:

IceG wrote:Hamilton left a leading team to go to an underperforming one because he could see the writing on the wall. Vettel has stayed with a dominant team despite the history of Renault's struggles with turbos and Newey's dislike of hot engines, he did not see what was coming.

Vettel has won championship after championship. Hamilton hasn't.

That is why vettelwinslol is boring and hamiltonwinslolo isn't (yet).

Holds no ice for me, mate. If we get hamiltonwinslol instead of vettelwinslol the spectacle will be just as boring just as fast. Unless you are a Hamilton fan, the only difference will be the annoyance of the The Finger post-race being replaced by the annoyance of Sky & the BBC's 'boffins' discussing whether or not Hamilton is the reincarnation of Senna post-race.

Exactly. It's not like it is all on Vettel. The boredom was not all on Vettel, it was on the quality of racing throughout the field and the quality of the usually crappy TV directors.

I think Adrian Newey is already a contender for ROTY becuase his design is already well flawed and how is he going to repackage such a tight car? The only way to solve its problems is to completely repackage it. Then the reliability might be a little better. And maybe the car will see its full potential. But the design seems as if he didn't care to consider cooling, and that with it the car was hastily put together as a result. Certainly his biggest car design dong in a while.

SgtPepper wrote:I think if the Mercs are as dominant as people predict (something of which I have my doubts) the dullness would be very dependant upon the degree to which;
a) Rosberg brings the fight to Hamilton,
b) How fast the Ferraris are,
c) If the TV directors ever decide to actually show anything below about 6th position.

If Rosberg performs well against Hamilton, it will be exciting seeing the inter-team battle, if the Ferraris are quick then it could be an incredible 4 way battle. But if neither of these happen, I'm sure it will soon turn in to a snooze-fest/Lewisteria extravaganza.

watka wrote:

SgtPepper wrote:I think if the Mercs are as dominant as people predict (something of which I have my doubts) the dullness would be very dependant upon the degree to which;
a) Rosberg brings the fight to Hamilton,
b) How fast the Ferraris are,
c) If the TV directors ever decide to actually show anything below about 6th position.

If Rosberg performs well against Hamilton, it will be exciting seeing the inter-team battle, if the Ferraris are quick then it could be an incredible 4 way battle. But if neither of these happen, I'm sure it will soon turn in to a snooze-fest/Lewisteria extravaganza.

Don't you mean Lewisteria LewistravagHamza?

watka wrote:Don't you mean Lewisteria LewistravagHamza?

FMecha wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ad4y5xepX9Q

MiniDrivers on Magneti Marelli's claim that no-one will finish Australia GP this year

FMecha wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ad4y5xepX9Q

MiniDrivers on Magneti Marelli's claim that no-one will finish Australia GP this year