Grand Prix Rejects

Posted: **20 Apr 2015, 06:52**

I was looking at the stats of Seb Buemi and saw that he actually never managed to beat his seventh in Australia 2009. Quite a rare feat. Which other drivers never beat their debut result? I can think of the obvious Farina and Parsons, plus Baghetti. Along with them at least Reine Wisell and Kevin Magnussen, although he could still have options to equal his second position last year.

Also drivers who started only a single race, which are obviously plenty.

Posted: **20 Apr 2015, 07:48**

GerhardTalger wrote:I was looking at the stats of Seb Buemi and saw that he actually never managed to beat his seventh in Australia 2009. Quite a rare feat. Which other drivers never beat their debut result? I can think of the obvious Farina and Parsons, plus Baghetti. Along with them at least Reine Wisell and Kevin Magnussen, although he could still have options to equal his second position last year.

Also drivers who started only a single race, which are obviously plenty.

I was going to say Alex Yoong and his seventh place in Australia 2002, then remember he had another three hopeless tries the year before...

I can think of Karl Kling and Mark Donohue who fit the bill.

Also, maybe not stats per se, but I only just learned an odd fact about the 1961 season. It was the first year where 9 points were awarded to the race winner, but only for drivers. Only 8 points were awarded to the winning constructor. The systems were aligned for 1962.

Posted: **20 Apr 2015, 10:27**

So Rosberg has apparently finished every race where he started. Has anyone done that for 4 races in a row?

Posted: **20 Apr 2015, 11:33**

Aguaman wrote:So Rosberg has apparently finished every race where he started. Has anyone done that for 4 races in a row?

Ascari poled and won four times in a row between '52 and 53, five times if you don't count Indianapolis, Senna took four consecutive poles and wins in early '91. Mansell did it four and five times non-consecutively in 1992.

Michael Schumacher did it six times from Italy 2000 to Malaysia 2001

Can't be bothered to check any more.

Posted: **20 Apr 2015, 11:53**

I was going to say Alex Yoong and his seventh place in Australia 2002, then remember he had another three hopeless tries the year before...

I can think of Karl Kling and Mark Donohue who fit the bill.

[/quote]

I thought of Yoong as well, but I knew he did three races the year before. Too bad McNish did contest that Australian race.

Ricardo Zunino is another one. He did finish seventh in his first GP, like Buemi.

Posted: **20 Apr 2015, 14:13**

tommykl wrote:
Aguaman wrote:So Rosberg has apparently finished every race where he started. Has anyone done that for 4 races in a row?

Ascari poled and won four times in a row between '52 and 53, five times if you don't count Indianapolis, Senna took four consecutive poles and wins in early '91. Mansell did it four and five times non-consecutively in 1992.

Michael Schumacher did it six times from Italy 2000 to Malaysia 2001

Can't be bothered to check any more.

Better question. Has anyone done it for 4 races in a row without one victory.

Posted: **20 Apr 2015, 14:19**

Conversely, I wonder how many drivers achieved their best result in their final F1 appearance?

I only have two so far, and the first one is an obscure one - Giulio Cabianca. His entire World Championship career was four races long, with a record of DNQ-Ret-15-4. I guess Jean-Louis Schlesser counts as well, given in his two appearances in F1, he was classified 11th after colliding with Senna, and his only prior attempt at F1 was a DNQ.

Posted: **20 Apr 2015, 16:10**

Biscione wrote:Conversely, I wonder how many drivers achieved their best result in their final F1 appearance?

I only have two so far, and the first one is an obscure one - Giulio Cabianca. His entire World Championship career was four races long, with a record of DNQ-Ret-15-4. I guess Jean-Louis Schlesser counts as well, given in his two appearances in F1, he was classified 11th after colliding with Senna, and his only prior attempt at F1 was a DNQ.

Jan Magnussen scored his only point on his last race, didn't he?

Also, Michael Andretti scored that podium in Monza in his final race.

Posted: **20 Apr 2015, 16:59**

tommykl wrote:
Biscione wrote:Conversely, I wonder how many drivers achieved their best result in their final F1 appearance?

I only have two so far, and the first one is an obscure one - Giulio Cabianca. His entire World Championship career was four races long, with a record of DNQ-Ret-15-4. I guess Jean-Louis Schlesser counts as well, given in his two appearances in F1, he was classified 11th after colliding with Senna, and his only prior attempt at F1 was a DNQ.

Jan Magnussen scored his only point on his last race, didn't he?

Also, Michael Andretti scored that podium in Monza in his final race.

Pretty ashamed to have forgotten the bleedin' obvious example of Andretti.

Not quite sure of my though process that got me there, but somehow Jan Magnussen reminded me of Chico Landi (?!?!), who indeed ended his World Championship career with the sole result that unrejectified him, a shared 4th place with Gerino Gerini.

And if shared drives do indeed count, that puts Luigi Fagioli in the frame, from that confusing circumstance where both he and Fangio finished 1st and 11th together from two shared drives in the same race.

Posted: **20 Apr 2015, 18:12**

Is Maldonado the only driver to be given a penalty for starting LOWER than he should of done?

Posted: **20 Apr 2015, 18:57**

Biscione wrote:Conversely, I wonder how many drivers achieved their best result in their final F1 appearance?

I only have two so far, and the first one is an obscure one - Giulio Cabianca. His entire World Championship career was four races long, with a record of DNQ-Ret-15-4. I guess Jean-Louis Schlesser counts as well, given in his two appearances in F1, he was classified 11th after colliding with Senna, and his only prior attempt at F1 was a DNQ.

In MotoGP, Simoncelli's last race before he died was a 2nd place, which was his best ever finish.

Posted: **21 Apr 2015, 21:39**

Both Corrado Fabi (Dallas '84) and the one and only Jean-Denis Deletraz (Nurburgring '95) achieved their best results in their final F1 appearance.
It was Deletraz's only finish, while Fabi came pretty close to scoring a point in a race of extreme attrition (just 8 cars made it to the finish), mostly known for Mansell fainting while trying to push his car past the finish line (he was indeed classified sixth, just ahead of Fabi).

Posted: **22 Apr 2015, 00:21**

Perry McCarthy's best result came in his last race too. DNQ by default.

Volker Weidler also scored his joint best result in his last race, a DNQ, by virtue of Christian Danner's Phoenix result preventing him from having to pre-qualify.

Onto the topic of best result on first attempt, it's not a driver, but the Modena Lamborghini team scored a 7th placed finish on their debut courtesy of Nicola Larini.

Posted: **22 Apr 2015, 00:49**

FullMetalJack wrote:Perry McCarthy's best result came in his last race too. DNQ by default.

Volker Weidler also scored his joint best result in his last race, a DNQ, by virtue of Christian Danner's Phoenix result preventing him from having to pre-qualify.

Onto the topic of best result on first attempt, it's not a driver, but the Modena Lamborghini team scored a 7th placed finish on their debut courtesy of Nicola Larini.

In similar fashion, March had their best result in their first year.

Posted: **22 Apr 2015, 12:35**

Jim Clark qualifies for best result in his last race with a victory, although he had them many times over. I can't think of any other driver (non-indy, non-shared, as Fagioli won that shared victory) who ended his F1-career with a victory, to be honest. Ugh, Indy and shared drives seemingly always destroy these cute records.

Between 1950 and 1969 there are seldom interesting names who had their best result in their first GP. Reg Parnell and Ken Wharton are among the most interesting. Bob Gerard does something funny too: Having his best result at both his first and last GP. It was sixth both times, considering it was the 50's he was a pretty unlucky chap.

Cesare Perdisa (shared drive, though), Yves Giraud-Cabantous (1950 GB) and Alan Brown are the other most interesting results. Discounting non-starts, Peter Arundell and Mike Parkes would qualify as well.

Posted: **22 Apr 2015, 13:06**

GerhardTalger wrote:Bob Gerard does something funny too: Having his best result at both his first and last GP. It was sixth both times, considering it was the 50's he was a pretty unlucky chap.

Gerard also has the unique distinction of being the only driver who scored no points but isn't a reject, as he scored three 6th places at a time when points were only awarded down to 5th place.

Posted: **22 Apr 2015, 13:49**

I can't believe that just TWO different teams have finished on the podium this season after the first 4 races!
I'm too lazy to work it out but this must be the first time in decades if not then the first time ever that this has happened [gasp, sulk]. That is scary and surprising at once.

Posted: **22 Apr 2015, 14:29**

good_Ralf wrote:I can't believe that just TWO different teams have finished on the podium this season after the first 4 races!
I'm too lazy to work it out but this must be the first time in decades if not then the first time ever that this has happened [gasp, sulk]. That is scary and surprising at once.

It's only the first time in almost a decade. Ferrari and McLaren were the only two teams on the podium for the first five races of 2007.

Posted: **22 Apr 2015, 15:38**

Simtek wrote:
good_Ralf wrote:I can't believe that just TWO different teams have finished on the podium this season after the first 4 races!
I'm too lazy to work it out but this must be the first time in decades if not then the first time ever that this has happened [gasp, sulk]. That is scary and surprising at once.

It's only the first time in almost a decade. Ferrari and McLaren were the only two teams on the podium for the first five races of 2007.

They dominated to the extent of only five podium finishes all season not belonging to them.

Heidfeld and Wurz in Canada
Webber in Germany
Heidfeld in Hungary
Kovalainen in Japan

Kubica somewhat surprisingly didn't even manage one.

Posted: **22 Apr 2015, 17:20**

FullMetalJack wrote:
Simtek wrote:
good_Ralf wrote:I can't believe that just TWO different teams have finished on the podium this season after the first 4 races!
I'm too lazy to work it out but this must be the first time in decades if not then the first time ever that this has happened [gasp, sulk]. That is scary and surprising at once.

It's only the first time in almost a decade. Ferrari and McLaren were the only two teams on the podium for the first five races of 2007.

They dominated to the extent of only five podium finishes all season not belonging to them.

Heidfeld and Wurz in Canada
Webber in Germany
Heidfeld in Hungary
Kovalainen in Japan

Kubica somewhat surprisingly didn't even manage one.

Wow, now I remember that. My brain was thinking back to the 90s and completely missed 2007. :lol:

As for Kubica, I believe he had a weak 2007 because he couldn't get the Bridgestones working the way he wanted. Hence after running Heidfeld close and sometimes beating him in 2006, he was generally smashed by Nick.
In fact Kubica had a zig-zag pattern, where one year he'd be on it (basically 2006, 08, 10) but off the boil in the other (2007 & 09).
Going back to my original query, before 2007 the last time looking at my All the Races book was in 1956, but that was when teams could have more than two cars!

Posted: **30 Apr 2015, 05:44**

The average wins/races ratio for the champion of a season is about .418
The longest span without a new champion was 1999-04
The longest spans with different champions every year were 1964-70 and 1976-82
The longest span without a second championship in a row is 1961-85

Posted: **06 May 2015, 14:51**

WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS BY MONTH BORN

January - 11 (1979, 1994-95, 2000-04, 2008-09, 2014)
February - 11 (1962, 1964, 1968, 1975, 1977-78, 1984-86, 1989, 1993)
March - 5 (1963, 1965, 1988, 1990-91)
April - 7 (1958-61, 1966, 1970, 1997)
May - 0 (best: 2nd - 1961, 1997, 2002, 2004)
June - 9 (1951, 1954-57, 1967, 1969, 1971, 1973)
July - 8 (1952-53, 2005-06, 2010-13)
August - 5 (1976, 1981, 1983, 1987, 1992)
September - 3 (1996, 1998-99)
October - 2 (1950, 2007)
November - 1 (1980)
December - 3 (1972, 1974, 1982)

GRAND PRIX WINS BY MONTH BORN

January - 175 (1956 Indianapolis 500-2015 Bahrain Grand Prix)
February - 128 (1957 British Grand Prix-1993 German Grand Prix)
March - 86 (1952 Indianapolis 500-2012 Spanish Grand Prix)
April - 68 (1953 French Grand Prix-2008 Brazilian Grand Prix)
May - 22 (1955 Indianapolis 500-2009 Italian Grand Prix)
June - 81 (1950 Monaco Grand Prix-2014 Brazilian Grand Prix)
July - 106 (1950 Indianapolis 500-2015 Malaysian Grand Prix)
August - 90 (1959 United States Grand Prix-2012 British Grand Prix)
September - 73 (1951 Indianapolis 500-2005 Brazilian Grand Prix)
October - 35 (1950 British Grand Prix-2013 Australian Grand Prix)
November - 30 (1956 Belgian Grand Prix-1999 Malaysian Grand Prix)
December - 29 (1953 Indianapolis 500-2008 Canadian Grand Prix)

Posted: **06 May 2015, 17:47**

Simtek wrote:WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS BY MONTH BORN

May - 0 (best: 2nd - 1961, 1997, 2002, 2004)

GRAND PRIX WINS BY MONTH BORN
May - 22 (1955 Indianapolis 500-2009 Italian Grand Prix)

Funny how THE month of motorsports (Monaco GP, Indy 500, Le Mans 24 hours and the World 600), May is the last in wins and the only month w/o a champion.

Posted: **06 May 2015, 18:03**

Jo Bonnier won the 1959 Dutch GP from the pole. He never had any other podium finish.

Brian Henton has a fastest lap, but no championship points. He is the only F1 driver with this dubious distinction. (Well, we all know Hashemi's "fastest lap" is actually Laffite's.)

Prince Bira has bested his own record of the best finishing Thai (Siamese) driver in F1 the first 3 times he raced and held it ever since. That's 64 years and 11 months.

Andrea Montermini has driven for Forti, Pacific, Simtek and MasterCard Lola. He has the full set in F1.
Also, in IndyCar, he drove for Coyne, Euromotorsport (which is Andrea Moda), Project Indy and a dead-on-its-legs AAR.
Proper. 90's Reject. Hero.

Posted: **07 May 2015, 20:13**

Rabbi Gordon wrote:Andrea Montermini has driven for Forti, Pacific, Simtek and MasterCard Lola. He has the full set in F1.

He certainly had a MasterCard Lola contract, but I'm not sure he ever actually drove the car.

Sources: Jamie and Enoch's interview with him on one of the podcasts plus this thread.

Posted: **08 May 2015, 13:03**

dr-baker wrote:
Rabbi Gordon wrote:Andrea Montermini has driven for Forti, Pacific, Simtek and MasterCard Lola. He has the full set in F1.

He certainly had a MasterCard Lola contract, but I'm not sure he ever actually drove the car.

Sources: Jamie and Enoch's interview with him on one of the podcasts plus this thread.

Well, of course you are right. Now that you mention I think I can recall that in the interview the old site had he himself said that he never drove it.

Posted: **09 May 2015, 23:49**

As far as I'm concerned, Andrea Montermini is the most fortunate guy in the world.

Posted: **25 May 2015, 21:24**

Rosberg is the first driver since Senna to win 3 races in a row (hat trick) in Monaco.
Maldonado failed again to finish a race in Monaco. Five retirements in a row.
Bottas never scored a point in Monaco.
Since 2012 season, the winner of Monaco Grand Prix doesn't win the championship.
It's the sixth race in a row with a safety car in Monaco (since 2010).

Posted: **27 May 2015, 21:03**

Dj_bereta wrote:[list]
[*]Since 2012 season, the winner of Monaco Grand Prix doesn't win the championship.

What are you trying to say?

Posted: **27 May 2015, 21:33**

Rob Dylan wrote:
Dj_bereta wrote:[list]
[*]Since 2012 season, the winner of Monaco Grand Prix doesn't win the championship.

What are you trying to say?

What just about everyone knows about the outcome of this championship

Posted: **28 May 2015, 03:39**

novitopoli wrote:
Rob Dylan wrote:
Dj_bereta wrote:[list]
[*]Since 2012 season, the winner of Monaco Grand Prix doesn't win the championship.

What are you trying to say?

What just about everyone knows about the outcome of this championship

So that means there are only 19 drivers in contention?

Posted: **28 May 2015, 08:19**

novitopoli wrote:
Rob Dylan wrote:
Dj_bereta wrote:[*]Since 2012 season, the winner of Monaco Grand Prix doesn't win the championship.

What are you trying to say?

What just about everyone knows about the outcome of this championship

Yes, and since 2011, the winner of the Australian Grand Prix hasn't won the championship. Therefore, Lewis' chances are as good as nil

Posted: **28 May 2015, 09:23**

tommykl wrote:
novitopoli wrote:
Dj_bereta wrote:[*]Since 2012 season, the winner of Monaco Grand Prix doesn't win the championship.

What just about everyone knows about the outcome of this championship

Yes, and since 2011, the winner of the Australian Grand Prix hasn't won the championship. Therefore, Lewis' chances are as good as nil

So it's Vettel's fifth championship then...

Posted: **28 May 2015, 10:08**

Am I right in saying that this is the first time 2 teams have locked out the podium 6 races in a row?

Posted: **28 May 2015, 11:13**

Francis23 wrote:Am I right in saying that this is the first time 2 teams have locked out the podium 6 races in a row?

Possibly, it only happened for the first five races of 2007, and whilst it almost always happened that year, the streak was always broken by the odd podium from a midfield team.

Posted: **28 May 2015, 12:01**

And it was in that race that Hamilton got his first win, Kubica almost died, and Alexander Wurz got a podium, surely we've got to be due a crazy race like that soon right?

Posted: **28 May 2015, 13:10**

Francis23 wrote:And it was in that race that Hamilton got his first win, Kubica almost died, and Alexander Wurz got a podium, surely we've got to be due a crazy race like that soon right?

I wish to see these drivers suffer for my entertainment! muhahaha!

Posted: **28 May 2015, 17:45**

Rob Dylan wrote:
Francis23 wrote:And it was in that race that Hamilton got his first win, Kubica almost died, and Alexander Wurz got a podium, surely we've got to be due a crazy race like that soon right?

I wish to see these drivers suffer for my entertainment! muhahaha!

Haha, and I almost forgot that in that race Quick Nick came 2nd and Takuma Sato overtook Alonso's McLaren, in a Super Aguri, around the outside.

Posted: **28 May 2015, 18:19**

Discounting Indy, Ferrari and Alfa Romeo were the only two teams on the podium for the whole of 1951.

But that's a completely different time. It never happened since 1986 at least, when teams never had more than two entries for a single race.

Posted: **29 May 2015, 03:49**

Francis23 wrote:
Rob Dylan wrote:
Francis23 wrote:And it was in that race that Hamilton got his first win, Kubica almost died, and Alexander Wurz got a podium, surely we've got to be due a crazy race like that soon right?

I wish to see these drivers suffer for my entertainment! muhahaha!

Haha, and I almost forgot that in that race Quick Nick came 2nd and Takuma Sato overtook Alonso's McLaren, in a Super Aguri, around the outside.

Sato's super Super Aguri move was like the only thing I remember from that race.

Grand Prix Rejects

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