2016 Silly Season Thread

Post by **Miguel98** » 01 Dec 2015, 15:47

So, from Carlos Sainz declarations we can only assume that Toro Rossi is using Ferrari engines from 2016 onwards.

http://www.thisisf1.com/2015/11/30/toro-rosso-to-be-more-italian-in-2016-f1-sainz/

Wallio · Post by **Wallio** » 01 Dec 2015, 16:01

Miguel98 wrote:So, from Carlos Sainz declarations we can only assume that Toro Rossi is using Ferrari engines from 2016 onwards.

http://www.thisisf1.com/2015/11/30/toro-rosso-to-be-more-italian-in-2016-f1-sainz/

NBC has reported this as well. Supposedly RBR will run rebadged Renaults next year as well. NBC claims they will be badged as Red Bulls, but I would guess Infinitis.

Post by **Ataxia** » 01 Dec 2015, 19:57

Wallio wrote:
Miguel98 wrote:So, from Carlos Sainz declarations we can only assume that Toro Rossi is using Ferrari engines from 2016 onwards.

http://www.thisisf1.com/2015/11/30/toro-rosso-to-be-more-italian-in-2016-f1-sainz/

NBC has reported this as well. Supposedly RBR will run rebadged Renaults next year as well. NBC claims they will be badged as Red Bulls, but I would guess Infinitis.

Christian Horner's said that "Ron Dennis won't like what it's called". So, that leaves two options:

a) Nissan will throw their weight behind a rebadging deal, ensuring that Honda have competition in the Japanese marque stakes, or...

b) According to Joe Saward, Mansour Ojjeh's selling his stake in McLaren, meaning that a TAG badging deal is on the cars for Red Bull.

tBone · Post by **tBone** » 01 Dec 2015, 21:20

Ataxia wrote:
Wallio wrote:
Miguel98 wrote:So, from Carlos Sainz declarations we can only assume that Toro Rossi is using Ferrari engines from 2016 onwards.

http://www.thisisf1.com/2015/11/30/toro-rosso-to-be-more-italian-in-2016-f1-sainz/

NBC has reported this as well. Supposedly RBR will run rebadged Renaults next year as well. NBC claims they will be badged as Red Bulls, but I would guess Infinitis.

Christian Horner's said that "Ron Dennis won't like what it's called". So, that leaves two options:

Why won't they use an abbreviation for "Renault Or Nissan"?

Red Bull - RON :pantano:

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 02 Dec 2015, 14:11

Apparently, the Force India-Aston Martin linkup is close to being finalised: http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122096

golic_2004 · Post by **golic_2004** » 02 Dec 2015, 18:36

Simtek wrote:Apparently, the Force India-Aston Martin linkup is close to being finalised: http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122096

You beat me to it :badoer:

Yannick · Post by **Yannick** » 02 Dec 2015, 19:46

June 12 - Canada
June 19 - Europe (Baku)

What a week for the F1 world this is going to be ... weary travelers and all ... oh my!

Jan Magnussen · Post by **Rob Dylan** » 02 Dec 2015, 19:47

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122103
21 races confirmed for next year. Jesus, that's just too many.
And Autosport's saying the American Grand Prix's the only one that's in any way under threat.

UncreativeUsername37 · Post by **UncreativeUsername37** » 02 Dec 2015, 21:24

Rob Dylan wrote:http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122103
21 races confirmed for next year. Jesus, that's just too many.
And Autosport's saying the American Grand Prix's the only one that's in any way under threat.

Twenty-one races in eight months. That'll be... interesting.

James1978 · Post by **James1978** » 02 Dec 2015, 21:27

I'm actually hoping Baku doesn't happen rather than Austin!!

WeirdKerr · Post by **WeirdKerr** » 02 Dec 2015, 21:30

Rob Dylan wrote:http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122103
21 races confirmed for next year. Jesus, that's just too many.
And Autosport's saying the American Grand Prix's the only one that's in any way under threat.

Oh no.... not again..... I smell a conspiracy, US grand prix in has been good suddenly its under threat because it had one race weekend that was a washout (on Friday and Saturday), though to be fair this was not as bad as what sort of saw off the Indy Gp

Fetzie · Post by **Fetzie** » 02 Dec 2015, 23:37

Maybe if they didn't host the race in Austin in the bathplugging HURRICANE SEASON...

AndreaModa · Post by **AndreaModa** » 03 Dec 2015, 00:12

Fetzie wrote:Maybe if they didn't host the race in Austin in the bathplugging HURRICANE SEASON...

Would moving it to the spring help in that respect? It's where it is because of Brazil (and now Mexico) being late in the season which makes for a logical and efficient run of events in the same region.

But perhaps it's worth shifting all three to the early part of the season, as they were in the early 90s. So maybe you could have the beginning of the calendar look like this:

Australia
(possibly Malaysia, so it's not next to Singapore later in the year)
Brazil
Mexico
USA
Then onto the European leg, and shift Bahrain to a September/October date. Everything else as normal.

Would that mitigate the weather problems?

AustralianStig · Post by **AustralianStig** » 03 Dec 2015, 00:13

James1978 wrote:I'm actually hoping Baku doesn't happen rather than Austin!!

I'm quite looking forward to Baku - it sounds like one of the most un-Tilke Tilke circuits ever.

Shizuka · Post by **Shizuka** » 03 Dec 2015, 09:01

Scuderia Toro Rosso-Ferrari (with 2015 spec engines)

Aguaman · Post by **Aguaman** » 03 Dec 2015, 09:21

AustralianStig wrote:
James1978 wrote:I'm actually hoping Baku doesn't happen rather than Austin!!

I'm quite looking forward to Baku - it sounds like one of the most un-Tilke Tilke circuits ever.

Also I like it when F1 goes to new places. Kind of.

Collieafc · Post by **Collieafc** » 03 Dec 2015, 13:04

UgncreativeUsergname wrote:
Rob Dylan wrote:http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122103
21 races confirmed for next year. Jesus, that's just too many.
And Autosport's saying the American Grand Prix's the only one that's in any way under threat.

Twenty-one races in eight months. That'll be... interesting.

Doesnt really matter how many there are, seeing as F1 is fast dissappearing behind a paywall.

Shame if the US does go - in my view its probably one of the few locations/markets that should always have a presence on the F1 calendar.

Post by **Nuppiz** » 03 Dec 2015, 13:59

AndreaModa wrote:
Fetzie wrote:Maybe if they didn't host the race in Austin in the bathplugging HURRICANE SEASON...

Would moving it to the spring help in that respect? It's where it is because of Brazil (and now Mexico) being late in the season which makes for a logical and efficient run of events in the same region.

But perhaps it's worth shifting all three to the early part of the season, as they were in the early 90s. So maybe you could have the beginning of the calendar look like this:

Australia
(possibly Malaysia, so it's not next to Singapore later in the year)
Brazil
Mexico
USA
Then onto the European leg, and shift Bahrain to a September/October date. Everything else as normal.

Would that mitigate the weather problems?

It probably would. But it's not going to happen because it'd require common sense, something which the current powers-that-be are severely lacking.

Post by **DemocalypseNow** » 03 Dec 2015, 14:23

AndreaModa wrote:
Fetzie wrote:Maybe if they didn't host the race in Austin in the bathplugging HURRICANE SEASON...

Would moving it to the spring help in that respect? It's where it is because of Brazil (and now Mexico) being late in the season which makes for a logical and efficient run of events in the same region.

But perhaps it's worth shifting all three to the early part of the season, as they were in the early 90s. So maybe you could have the beginning of the calendar look like this:

Australia
(possibly Malaysia, so it's not next to Singapore later in the year)
Brazil
Mexico
USA
Then onto the European leg, and shift Bahrain to a September/October date. Everything else as normal.

Would that mitigate the weather problems?

A by-product of this would also be the reduction in downpours at Interlagos. April is usually a far drier month in Sao Paulo than October/November.

Jan Magnussen · Post by **Rob Dylan** » 03 Dec 2015, 14:57

What one needs to do is to place half of the tracks (the ones with changeable weather conditions) on their coldest, most rainiest weekend of the year every year. So tracks like Interlagos would always be like October / November. Then the other half (a.k.a. desert tracks like at Bahrain) should be placed at the absolute height of summer heat, and lack of humidity. Also completely ignore the practicality of moving all the pit crews to a completely different continent every weekend.

So a winter Russian round is followed by a baking hot Australian Summer round

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 03 Dec 2015, 15:08

Tyre choices will be kept confidential until two weeks before the race.

Well, I have a better idea Bernie. Are you reading? Of course you are.

Some 25 minutes before the race, each team, following the reverse order to the qualification classification, is allowed a minute at a time to find 4 suitable tyres from a pile of tyres to the respective driver. The remaining minutes will be used to fit the tyres and start the warm up lap. At half race, and according to the reverse order of classification, mechanics are then allowed another minute to go pick 4 new tyres, if they want, in order to do a pit-stop tyre switch.

You're welcome Bernie!

Jan Magnussen · Post by **Rob Dylan** » 03 Dec 2015, 16:48

90% of the tyres in the pile are full wets.
2 mandatory pit stops are now required during the race.

golic_2004 · Post by **golic_2004** » 03 Dec 2015, 17:18

It's official.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122120

Izzyeviel · Post by **Izzyeviel** » 03 Dec 2015, 19:09

Too soon to start the 2017 silly season thread? I'm quite tempted to make one considering the news that Mercedes are thinking about dropping Nico.

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 03 Dec 2015, 19:41

golic_2004 wrote:It's official.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122120

Spectoremg · Post by **Spectoremg** » 03 Dec 2015, 20:10

Izzyeviel wrote:Too soon to start the 2017 silly season thread? I'm quite tempted to make one considering the news that Mercedes are thinking about dropping Nico.

I saw this story in a couple of papers today. What's going on all you in depth analysts?

Izzyeviel · Post by **Izzyeviel** » 04 Dec 2015, 03:43

Spectoremg wrote:
Izzyeviel wrote:Too soon to start the 2017 silly season thread? I'm quite tempted to make one considering the news that Mercedes are thinking about dropping Nico.

I saw this story in a couple of papers today. What's going on all you in depth analysts?

If they are going to drop a driver in 2017, it won't be the 4 time world champion who's got 2 years left on the contract, but poor Nico who's contract ends 2016. They can have 2 years bedding in a younger driver so that when Lewis does leave, they have a ready replacement.

Makes further sense when you consider Lewis is slagging him off every chance he gets - he'd only do that if he was a big idiot or had support from the board.

Peteroli34 · Post by **Peteroli34** » 04 Dec 2015, 10:25

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122128

So Red Bull will run Tag Heuer branded Renualt engines for 2016. The question is who do they complain about if the engine ends up as bad as it was this year

Jan Magnussen · Post by **Rob Dylan** » 04 Dec 2015, 10:44

I don't even understand how the "branding" even works. Is it simply a name stuck on a Renault engine, or does TAG have some kind of input into the engine itself?

FullMetalJack · Post by **FullMetalJack** » 04 Dec 2015, 12:08

Rob Dylan wrote:I don't even understand how the "branding" even works. Is it simply a name stuck on a Renault engine, or does TAG have some kind of input into the engine itself?

Just a name. Do you think Acer had any input into the Ferrari engine Prost used in 2001? Or Petronas having any input into the Ferrari engines that Sauber used for years?

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 04 Dec 2015, 12:35

FullMetalJack wrote:
Rob Dylan wrote:I don't even understand how the "branding" even works. Is it simply a name stuck on a Renault engine, or does TAG have some kind of input into the engine itself?

Just a name. Do you think Acer had any input into the Ferrari engine Prost used in 2001? Or Petronas having any input into the Ferrari engines that Sauber used for years?

And I doubt TAG had much input into McLaren's Porsche engines in the 1980s?

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 04 Dec 2015, 14:29

Rob Dylan wrote:I don't even understand how the "branding" even works. Is it simply a name stuck on a Renault engine, or does TAG have some kind of input into the engine itself?

Don't ask me I thought Mecachrome was a Decepticon.

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 04 Dec 2015, 14:38

peteroli34 wrote:http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122128

So Red Bull will run Tag Heuer branded Renualt engines for 2016. The question is who do they complain about if the engine ends up as bad as it was this year

If I was Renault I would say: "Look, Red Bull, that this it is now Tag Heuer's problem. It is branded after them so I don't care even one bit if you like or not. Now shut up because I need to improve my stuff's competitiveness".

Izzyeviel · Post by **Izzyeviel** » 04 Dec 2015, 17:34

peteroli34 wrote:http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122128

So Red Bull will run Tag Heuer branded Renualt engines for 2016. The question is who do they complain about if the engine ends up as bad as it was this year

Depends how much cash Red Bull are willing to throw at them. Both Renault and Ilmor know what they're doing, but they don't have the resources to compete with Ferrari or Mercedes I fear.

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 04 Dec 2015, 17:44

Izzyeviel wrote:
peteroli34 wrote:http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122128

So Red Bull will run Tag Heuer branded Renualt engines for 2016. The question is who do they complain about if the engine ends up as bad as it was this year

Depends how much cash Red Bull are willing to throw at them. Both Renault and Ilmor know what they're doing, but they don't have the resources to compete with Ferrari or Mercedes I fear.

One thing that confuses me about this is that I thought Mercedes had bought out Ilmor some years ago (maybe about 10 years ago?) and had renamed it Mercedes High Performance Engines (or something along those lines). Did Mercedes sell up again to Mario Illien, or did the deal fall through, or did I just imagine all that?

Post by **mario** » 04 Dec 2015, 18:27

dr-baker wrote:
Izzyeviel wrote:
peteroli34 wrote:http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122128

So Red Bull will run Tag Heuer branded Renualt engines for 2016. The question is who do they complain about if the engine ends up as bad as it was this year

Depends how much cash Red Bull are willing to throw at them. Both Renault and Ilmor know what they're doing, but they don't have the resources to compete with Ferrari or Mercedes I fear.

One thing that confuses me about this is that I thought Mercedes had bought out Ilmor some years ago (maybe about 10 years ago?) and had renamed it Mercedes High Performance Engines (or something along those lines). Did Mercedes sell up again to Mario Illien, or did the deal fall through, or did I just imagine all that?

The confusion arises because Illien has been reusing the "Ilmor Engineering" brand name for his current company, even though it no longer has any ties with Mercedes.

In the early 2000's, Illien set up a specialist group within Ilmor that was known as the Special Projects Group, which eventually grew to become a semi-independent business operating under Ilmor Engineering. When Mercedes purchased Ilmor, Illien was allowed to retain ownership of the Special Projects Group and the "Ilmor Engineering" brand. He then renamed the Special Projects Group "Ilmor Engineering", which is the company which exists to this day.

The rest of the original company is still owned by Mercedes and was renamed as Mercedes High Performance Engines - what Illien has is a small chunk of the original company that has retained its original name.

CaptainGetz12 · Post by **CaptainGetz12** » 04 Dec 2015, 18:36

Shizuka wrote:Scuderia Toro Rosso-Ferrari (with 2015 spec engines)

I am curious on how they can get last-year's engines. Isn't the FIA discouraging these deals in favor of everyone using brand-new engines? This article may suggest a change of heart from the FIA.

Marussia used 2014-spec Ferraris this year as part of their settlement to leave administration. Does Toro Rosso have a similar settlement that I may have missed?

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 04 Dec 2015, 18:43

CaptainGetz12 wrote:
Shizuka wrote:Scuderia Toro Rosso-Ferrari (with 2015 spec engines)

I am curious on how they can get last-year's engines. Isn't the FIA discouraging these deals in favor of everyone using brand-new engines? This article may suggest a change of heart from the FIA.

Marussia used 2014-spec Ferraris this year as part of their settlement to leave administration. Does Toro Rosso have a similar settlement that I may have missed?

They amended the rules regarding engine specs literally only two days ago at the FIA World Motor Sport Council meeting.

AxelP800 · Post by **AxelP800** » 05 Dec 2015, 03:57

The good news for Toro Rosso is now they have more engine power. The fear is they may become relatively underpowered

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 06 Dec 2015, 16:40

mario wrote:
dr-baker wrote:One thing that confuses me about this is that I thought Mercedes had bought out Ilmor some years ago (maybe about 10 years ago?) and had renamed it Mercedes High Performance Engines (or something along those lines). Did Mercedes sell up again to Mario Illien, or did the deal fall through, or did I just imagine all that?

The confusion arises because Illien has been reusing the "Ilmor Engineering" brand name for his current company, even though it no longer has any ties with Mercedes.

In the early 2000's, Illien set up a specialist group within Ilmor that was known as the Special Projects Group, which eventually grew to become a semi-independent business operating under Ilmor Engineering. When Mercedes purchased Ilmor, Illien was allowed to retain ownership of the Special Projects Group and the "Ilmor Engineering" brand. He then renamed the Special Projects Group "Ilmor Engineering", which is the company which exists to this day.

The rest of the original company is still owned by Mercedes and was renamed as Mercedes High Performance Engines - what Illien has is a small chunk of the original company that has retained its original name.

Thanks Mario. I'm glad I wasn't misremembering the facts!