F1 To Be Split Between BBC 1 and Sky Sports from 2012

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 14 Mar 2012, 11:49

big_sly_doc wrote:
dr-baker wrote:
big_sly_doc wrote:Seeing as us colonial commoners here in Australia...

Reference to 5 Live Film Review podcast with Simon Mayo and Mark Kermode?

Yes indeed! I've been addicted to Kermode and Mayo for years and years! Religious podcast listener!

In which case, I think it might be necessary to say, "Hello to Jason Issacs" then? Or maybe we ought to set up our local version - "Hello to HWNSNBM!"

Paul Hayes · Post by **Paul Hayes** » 17 Mar 2012, 07:19

Qualifying today - I liked it. I've always like Croft, and he clearly works well with Brundle. They had some absolutely bloody stupid VTs - "we've had some great Australian Grands Prix in the past... Here are some still photos of them" - but the BBC and ITV always did as well, along with the ridiculous "this is Formula One" type monologues, so you can't single them out for blame on that score. The more I see him, the more I am convinced presenter Simon Lazenby is a clone of Jake Humphrey - who I like, but it seems a bit unimaginative!

TheBigJ · Post by **TheBigJ** » 17 Mar 2012, 14:25

Not bad coverage from the Beeb, will be interesting to see the ratings, hope Sky get raped in that department... :twisted:

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 17 Mar 2012, 17:12

Ben Edwards was pretty good I thought, but that opening segment on the BBC was utter rubbish I thought.

Shadaza · Post by **Shadaza** » 17 Mar 2012, 17:37

Georgie Thompson and Ant Davidson at the Sky Pad makes me laugh. Here is to paraphrase the sequence

GT:Hi, myself and Ant here will go through Hamilton's pole lap
AD:Well here it is, *talks through the entire lap by himself in fantastic detail*
GT:back to the studio

Might as well be Davidson on his own!

Post by **Ataxia** » 17 Mar 2012, 17:43

The Sky coverage was pretty damn good. Simon Lazenby comes across well, and with Brundle and Hill are making a good team. I always enjoy Ted Kravitz's input, and Ant Davidson seems as enthusiastic as ever. Not too sure about Georgie Thompson on the Skypad, I noticed she just nods a bit when Ant's explaining stuff, as Shadaza just mentioned.

But generally, it's got a fair bit of potential, and the Crofty/Brundle commentary just seems completely natural.

As long as ITV-Lewisteria circa 2007/2008 doesn't develop, I'll be very happy.

Paul Hayes · Post by **Paul Hayes** » 17 Mar 2012, 18:42

I'll say this much about the BBC coverage - I think the opening titles are the best they've had since they started covering the sport again!

AndreaModa · Post by **AndreaModa** » 17 Mar 2012, 19:02

Paul Hayes wrote:I'll say this much about the BBC coverage - I think the opening titles are the best they've had since they started covering the sport again!

I think that was the best part of the whole programme! Very disappointed with the BBC's output in general as I mentioned in the ROTR thread. The commentary isn't too bad though. As soon as I can though I'll be switching to Sky.

Post by **DemocalypseNow** » 17 Mar 2012, 19:14

Paul Hayes wrote:I'll say this much about the BBC coverage - I think the opening titles are the best they've had since they started covering the sport again!

Considering how average the first one was, it's not saying much. Personally, I think they should bring back the blackbeat.

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 17 Mar 2012, 21:47

I'm actually glad I tuned into the BBC. Live on the radio early this morning, that is. Otherwise the highlights would have been intorlerable, good as the commentators were in the limited time that they had... Radio it will be again tomorrow morning, otherwise the highlights just won't be worth it by themselves. Live will be fine on the BBC, but highlights just don't do it justice (unless it's Valencia or Borerain...).

And the opening credits are brilliant! Love the historical clips intertwinned into it!

sswishbone · Post by **sswishbone** » 17 Mar 2012, 22:31

Gary anderson is the most unintelligible person I have ever heard, I watched his analysis of the Ferrari and was looking for the subtitles!

AndreaModa · Post by **AndreaModa** » 17 Mar 2012, 23:39

Yeah it doesn't lend itself well to mid-race calls over the noise of screaming V8 engines, let alone the quiet of a studio or the back of the paddock! :lol:

RealRacingRoots · Post by **RealRacingRoots** » 18 Mar 2012, 01:29

sswishbone wrote:I watched his analysis of the Ferrari and was looking for the subtitles!

According to Richards F1, The media center in Melborneare calling Alonso's car Clifford, because it's a big, red,dog.

http://richardsf1.com/2012/03/18/chicanes-disguised-as-hrtf1s/#more-27892

TomWazzleshaw · Post by **TomWazzleshaw** » 18 Mar 2012, 02:08

You know, I'd give an arm and a leg to have the BBC coverage over the ONE feed here. And THAT'S saying something

eagleash · Post by **eagleash** » 18 Mar 2012, 03:10

dr-baker wrote:I'm actually glad I tuned into the BBC. Live on the radio early this morning, that is. Otherwise the highlights would have been intorlerable, good as the commentators were in the limited time that they had... Radio it will be again tomorrow morning, otherwise the highlights just won't be worth it by themselves. Live will be fine on the BBC, but highlights just don't do it justice (unless it's Valencia or Borerain...).

And the opening credits are brilliant! Love the historical clips intertwinned into it!

I've a suspicion that the BBC highlights programme is probably edited & supplied by SKY (not entirely sure, so if anyone has any definite info. all well & good). To the average SKY (no understanding of) sports editor a car sliding into a gravel trap is not of interest, it's equivalent to not quite scoring a goal & unless something really dramatic happens (e.g. Montoyas recent NASCAR mishap) is just not sensationalist enough for them.

RealRacingRoots · Post by **RealRacingRoots** » 18 Mar 2012, 03:37

Wizzie wrote:You know, I'd give an arm and a leg to have the BBC coverage over the ONE feed here. And THAT'S saying something

Move to Canada, we get the BBC commentary feed.

Paul Hayes · Post by **Paul Hayes** » 18 Mar 2012, 04:51

eagleash wrote:
dr-baker wrote:I'm actually glad I tuned into the BBC. Live on the radio early this morning, that is. Otherwise the highlights would have been intorlerable, good as the commentators were in the limited time that they had... Radio it will be again tomorrow morning, otherwise the highlights just won't be worth it by themselves. Live will be fine on the BBC, but highlights just don't do it justice (unless it's Valencia or Borerain...).

And the opening credits are brilliant! Love the historical clips intertwinned into it!

I've a suspicion that the BBC highlights programme is probably edited & supplied by SKY (not entirely sure, so if anyone has any definite info. all well & good).

I very much doubt it. I don't work for that part of the BBC and have nothing to do with F1, but I do know that this would be extremely unlikely.

WeirdKerr · Post by **WeirdKerr** » 18 Mar 2012, 07:50

ooops i was gonna listen to james and jaime on 5 live....

eagleash · Post by **eagleash** » 18 Mar 2012, 08:26

Paul Hayes wrote:
eagleash wrote:
dr-baker wrote:I'm actually glad I tuned into the BBC. Live on the radio early this morning, that is. Otherwise the highlights would have been intorlerable, good as the commentators were in the limited time that they had... Radio it will be again tomorrow morning, otherwise the highlights just won't be worth it by themselves. Live will be fine on the BBC, but highlights just don't do it justice (unless it's Valencia or Borerain...).

And the opening credits are brilliant! Love the historical clips intertwinned into it!

I've a suspicion that the BBC highlights programme is probably edited & supplied by SKY (not entirely sure, so if anyone has any definite info. all well & good).

I very much doubt it. I don't work for that part of the BBC and have nothing to do with F1, but I do know that this would be extremely unlikely.

OK. Thanks. I was working from the criticism that the BBC coverage of qualy has received (partic.Q3) & on the basis that C5 take the SKY cricket highlights & transmit exacto. (Plus the fact that the BBC pays SKY something like a £10m re-transmission fee every year..though not related solely to F1 obviously).
With regard to the grumbles about Q3. I watched it on the iPlayer last night & the transmitted coverage began at 7 minutes 30 remaining, & the commentators first comment was "Rosberg is the first car out in Q3" so all that seems to have been cut is 2.5 minutes of empty track/waffle. So not as heinous a crime as some comments in ROTR might have us believe.

WIDD · Post by **WIDD** » 18 Mar 2012, 09:38

What was the Sky coverage like outside of the race? Croft/Brundle were a superb combination, how the BBC never had the sense to put the two of them together I will never understand.

Heard that Damon Hill was a disaster through twitter mind you...

Paul Hayes · Post by **Paul Hayes** » 18 Mar 2012, 14:02

From what I saw of the Sky coverage I thought Hill was fine, nicely laid-back and relaxed with sensible points to make.

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 18 Mar 2012, 15:31

Just watched the race highlights on BBC TV. Loved the comments on seeing Damon Hill mid-race - saying how he must have had great memories of Melbourne, how miserable he looked, but absolutely no mention of why he was there!

But sad at the lack of podium coverage. :cry:

Glad I listened to it all on the radio first though, even though pretty much the whole race was shown (barring a section behind the safety car). Although I was reading this forum at the same time!

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 18 Mar 2012, 16:19

I enjoyed the BBC coverage, the challenge is not learning the result. Obv its not as good as live but it wasnt too bad, Diet F1 if you like. I feel a bit sorry for the BBC to be honest, they're invited to the party but not allowed to play with all the toys.

Warren Hughes · Post by **Warren Hughes** » 18 Mar 2012, 16:59

I agree with Coops that the BBC's race coverage was good, on the whole. Ben Edwards was excellent and made me wonder why the Beeb didn't get him in 2009. The race highlights were pretty easy to follow I thought, the annoying thing - as Coops said - is having to avoid finding out the results. This is going to be worse for the European and American Grands Prix with the highlights being on at a rather less convenient time.

Alianora La Canta · Post by **Alianora La Canta** » 18 Mar 2012, 17:22

I found the BBC coverage completely unusuable. After doing a good job in practise and qualifying, James Allen inexplicably decided he needed to double his talking speed in the race - which meant I couldn't pick out any of the words he was saying. Jaime Alguersuari mumbled a lot, with the same effect. Hoping the BBC TV highlights would be better, I was disappointed to find that Ben Edwards screamed half the time in a way that made it impossible to pick out what words he was saying. David Coulthard was good - when he could get a word in edgeways. The 16:9 formatting forced onto a 4:3 TV (which I thought was against the BBC's rules) meant I couldn't see the positions, so it was a struggle to even figure out what was happening visually. I had to resort to reading internet reports to know what went on in the race, which is pretty upsetting when one has already invested 3 hours into trying to follow the 1.5 hour race.

From what I've read, David Croft on Sky had the same problem as Ben Edwards, meaning that had I been able to pay, I'd have been just as unable to get a commentary that was comprehensible. It looks like from now on I needn't bother avoiding spoilers or watch/listen to broadcast coverage of F1 races.

IdeFan · Post by **IdeFan** » 18 Mar 2012, 18:11

I find the problem with most commentators is that they say what we can all see at home (I know this is basically what Murray Walker did but Murray did it with his own irrepressible enthusiasm and endearing style). By simply saying what we can all see and getting louder/faster every time something exciting happens is basically imitating Murray, and that's never going to work, I can see whats going on, so tell me something I don't know or shut up!

Obviously different for radio commentary, but there were times this morning where James Allen seemed to forget he was on the radio and "yell look at that!" or "you can see there that".

I can't James, its radio.

AdrianSutil · Post by **AdrianSutil** » 18 Mar 2012, 18:36

I thought Ben Edwards did a pretty good job. He knows his stuff on F1, mentioning a few times stuff that had happened a few years ago. Reminds me of Murray Walker a little bit. Really enthusiastic and funny.

Barbazza · Post by **Barbazza** » 18 Mar 2012, 19:30

I thought the BBC did pretty well, actually. I also managed to avoid knowing the result and was able to watch it on HD for the first time having got a new TV on Friday, so that helped!

Title sequence much better than before (admittedly not hard)
Not much pre-race chat : thank goodness!
Race coverage very good - I knew Ben Edwards would be decent and he didn't let me down. One thing though - can we see EVERY retirement please? One minute Kovalainen was in the race, the next minute he wasn't.
Post-race coverage - OK, as although Eddie Jordan drove me mad that's no change from last year. I didn't miss the press conference as not much interesting is said there anyway, but it might have been nice to see a little more of the podium.

Gary Anderson was a total idiot though, explaining after just a few laps that 'obviously' everyone was on 2 stop strategies then a few laps later saying how clearly everyone would be stopping 3 times. OK....

Paul Hayes · Post by **Paul Hayes** » 18 Mar 2012, 19:35

Alianora La Canta wrote:The 16:9 formatting forced onto a 4:3 TV (which I thought was against the BBC's rules) meant I couldn't see the positions

That'll be down to your own TV and / or receiver set-up, I'm afraid. The BBC will have broadcast the race in full 16:9 on all digital and HD platforms, and in 14:9 on analogue. The position graphics are certainly 14:9 safe. I think they're probably mostly 4:3 safe as well, although possibly not on TVs with larger amounts of overscan.

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 18 Mar 2012, 20:23

Barbazza wrote:Not much pre-race chat : thank goodness!

That was key in my opinion and to be honest I thought they'd get that wrong. I was really pleased they got it the right way round; brief chat, race, long chat.

S951 · Post by **S951** » 18 Mar 2012, 21:38

watched in a stream and well it was like normal to a degree got bored part way went back to sleep

AndreaModa · Post by **AndreaModa** » 18 Mar 2012, 22:43

I have to agree with most of the positive comments about the BBC coverage of the race to be honest. I only got to watch it on iplayer at about 7pm UK time, so 5 hours after the BBC broadcast it, and although I had to be quick witted to avoid the results on a few occasions, it wasn't too much of a problem. If I'm honest, I've had to do it before when I haven't been able to watch the race live in previous seasons, so the experience wasn't new to me.

The coverage itself was by and large good. The commentary team of Coulthard and Edwards worked very well I thought, and having Gary Anderson available every so often for expert comments - particularly on Kobayashi's rear wing damage - was very useful indeed. Going back and forth to him on tyre strategies was a bit too much in my opinion though. The fact that very little of the race itself was actually removed from the editing was also pleasant, and with the drivers' positions constantly at the bottom of the screen now, made it easy to follow. You have to be switched on though occasionally, so the casual fan may struggle in this respect, particularly around pit stop phases where positions change quickly.

The lack of pre-race build up wasn't that great I think - they didn't go into detail on the grid line-up, and said nothing about how the cars were different in 2012 or anything like that. Absolutely nothing on technical aspects was also a shame. I would have thought having Gary Anderson on the team would allow them even greater scope than what was previously available with Kravitz and Brundle, but never mind. The long post-race discussion was sufficient, and very similar to the last few years so I was happy with that.

Overall I have to retract my criticisms of the coverage following qualifying, and say that the BBC coverage isn't actually that bad. It'll be interesting to see how they deal with future races when showing just highlights, and also how much different the live coverage will be. I don't think they can add that much more to what they're already providing with the highlights package, with the exception of course of the complete sessions. They've effectively put their F1 show on a diet, and come out with a faster, leaner production, that manages not to compromise the actual race coverage, and just removes a lot of the often unnecessary pre and post race waffle and montages.

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 19 Mar 2012, 07:09

AndreaModa wrote:just removes a lot of the often unnecessary pre and post race waffle and montages.

Some of which was incredibly cheesy. I also used to hate the cringe-worthy moments where Team Principles were manhandled into shot for some back-slappingly inane chats.

I think I just miss the feeling of it being live and to be honest at the "start" of BBCs actual race I was as excited as normal so, meh, glad I wasnt one of the fools who got SKY just for F1 :lol:

AndreaModa · Post by **AndreaModa** » 19 Mar 2012, 11:26

CoopsII wrote:
AndreaModa wrote:just removes a lot of the often unnecessary pre and post race waffle and montages.

Some of which was incredibly cheesy. I also used to hate the cringe-worthy moments where Team Principles were manhandled into shot for some back-slappingly inane chats.

I think I just miss the feeling of it being live and to be honest at the "start" of BBCs actual race I was as excited as normal so, meh, glad I wasnt one of the fools who got SKY just for F1

Yeah, I often didn't enjoy all the rubbish the ITV team used to natter on about prior to races either. I think the programme is better off without it.

In related news today, the BBC Sport website has published a story detailing how Channel 4 has secured the TV rights to all horse racing events from 2013 onwards, meaning that the Grand National, Ascot and the Derby move across from the BBC. Now I'm not a follower of the sport, and hate watching it on TV, but I know how the National was one of those 'marque' events the BBC treasured in its sporting calender, so losing it along with all horse racing is pretty poor. I do know Channel 4 are held in high regard for doing a good job with racing, so for those fans it must be pleasing to have it all on one channel. But where does this leave the BBC? Along with the cancelling of their previous F1 contract to give us what we have now, they've also ditched another sport now, and their sports programming is looking increasingly thin on the ground.

It also begs the question, would C4 have taken the extra horse racing had they been able to secure F1? I think it's more of a consolation between the two parties after the BBC blocked C4's attempt to keep all of F1 on free-to-air TV, and should that be the case, proves very disappointing indeed. It will have allowed the BBC to get what it wants (i.e. still have F1, and cut costs), whilst at the same time off-loading another sport and the costs that come with broadcasting it, onto another channel, thus saving itself even more money. I know times are hard these days, but this is looking increasingly desperate from the Beeb, who must know they've over-stretched themselves with Olympics coverage.

Paul Hayes · Post by **Paul Hayes** » 19 Mar 2012, 19:14

Excellent overnight figures for Sky, you have to say - peaking at 1 million for the end of the race, which is better than I expected them to do. The average of over 800,000 for the race is pretty good too.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012/ma ... grand-prix

TheBigJ · Post by **TheBigJ** » 19 Mar 2012, 19:54

Paul Hayes wrote:Excellent overnight figures for Sky, you have to say - peaking at 1 million for the end of the race, which is better than I expected them to do. The average of over 800,000 for the race is pretty good too.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012/ma ... grand-prix

I'm sorry, but that's incredibly worrying signs...imagine tracks like Valencia, where you have a boring track + the BBC covering it. Down 75% from last year and a dodgy quote for the Sky officials says it all.

What's more worrying is that an FA Cup match between two boring sides got 5 times more viewers.

Paul Hayes · Post by **Paul Hayes** » 19 Mar 2012, 20:09

TheBigJ wrote:
Paul Hayes wrote:Excellent overnight figures for Sky, you have to say - peaking at 1 million for the end of the race, which is better than I expected them to do. The average of over 800,000 for the race is pretty good too.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012/ma ... grand-prix

I'm sorry, but that's incredibly worrying signs...imagine tracks like Valencia, where you have a boring track + the BBC covering it. Down 75% from last year and a dodgy quote for the Sky officials says it all.

What's more worrying is that an FA Cup match between two boring sides got 5 times more viewers.

They were never going to get anything like the figures for a free-to-air broadcast. For a subscription sports channel showing an event that started at 6am, that's a superb set of figures. There's no question that Sky will be delighted.

Faustus · Post by **Faustus** » 19 Mar 2012, 20:21

BaconLettuceNinja wrote:The Sky coverage was pretty damn good. Simon Lazenby comes across well, and with Brundle and Hill are making a good team. I always enjoy Ted Kravitz's input, and Ant Davidson seems as enthusiastic as ever. Not too sure about Georgie Thompson on the Skypad, I noticed she just nods a bit when Ant's explaining stuff, as Shadaza just mentioned.

But generally, it's got a fair bit of potential, and the Crofty/Brundle commentary just seems completely natural.

As long as ITV-Lewisteria circa 2007/2008 doesn't develop, I'll be very happy.

I watched the coverage on Sky as well and I must admit that I liked it. Simon Lazenby I found a bit bland, but Brundle and Hill do make for a good analysis team. Great to see Ant and Ted Kravitz and their stuff was great. Also, Crofty is great.
I've recorded the BBC highlights and I need to watch them soon to compare the coverage and the commentary.

Barbazza · Post by **Barbazza** » 19 Mar 2012, 21:31

AndreaModa wrote:In related news today, the BBC Sport website has published a story detailing how Channel 4 has secured the TV rights to all horse racing events from 2013 onwards, meaning that the Grand National, Ascot and the Derby move across from the BBC. Now I'm not a follower of the sport, and hate watching it on TV, but I know how the National was one of those 'marque' events the BBC treasured in its sporting calender, so losing it along with all horse racing is pretty poor. I do know Channel 4 are held in high regard for doing a good job with racing, so for those fans it must be pleasing to have it all on one channel. But where does this leave the BBC? Along with the cancelling of their previous F1 contract to give us what we have now, they've also ditched another sport now, and their sports programming is looking increasingly thin on the ground.

It also begs the question, would C4 have taken the extra horse racing had they been able to secure F1? I think it's more of a consolation between the two parties after the BBC blocked C4's attempt to keep all of F1 on free-to-air TV, and should that be the case, proves very disappointing indeed. It will have allowed the BBC to get what it wants (i.e. still have F1, and cut costs), whilst at the same time off-loading another sport and the costs that come with broadcasting it, onto another channel, thus saving itself even more money. I know times are hard these days, but this is looking increasingly desperate from the Beeb, who must know they've over-stretched themselves with Olympics coverage.

A pretty good summary I think. At least as The Grand National is a 'protected' event we still get to see it on free-to-air. Plus C4 do a very good job of the Horse Racing.
Give it a few years, when Premiership highlights disappear (again) to leave the BBC with just the FA Cup (again) plus a few other piddly matches no-one really cares about, and all that will be left of any great note will be Wimbledon which of course will never go lest the BBC cause all Daily Mail readers to have an embolism.

AndreaModa · Post by **AndreaModa** » 19 Mar 2012, 22:17

The BBC don't even have the FA Cup at the moment! :lol: