Your Reject of the Race - Britain

AxelP800 · Post by **AxelP800** » 30 Jun 2013, 17:38

GwilymJJames wrote:A number of people have been making a fundamental mistake in this thread. They have been saying that four tyres failed during the race.In fact there were five, the fifth being Gutierrez's front left, which also damaged his front wing.

Yeah I just remembered the TV shows Gutierrez's wing disintigrated as he passes Hangar Straight which is also tyre failure

WeirdKerr · Post by **WeirdKerr** » 30 Jun 2013, 17:52

my nomination just exploded... L P
I
L I
E R

Dan B · Post by **Dan B** » 30 Jun 2013, 18:06

A Certain Unreliable Italian Tire Manufacturer gets my nomination. That was inexcusable.

That said I am wondering what will be the course of action concerning them, especially with the German GP coming up this week.

Post by **mario** » 30 Jun 2013, 18:19

Dan B wrote:A Certain Unreliable Italian Tire Manufacturer gets my nomination. That was inexcusable.

That said I am wondering what will be the course of action concerning them, especially with the German GP coming up this week.

An emergency meeting with the Sporting Working Group on Wednesday, on Todt's orders, with Pirelli compelled to bring a solution to that meeting.

GwilymJJames wrote:A number of people have been making a fundamental mistake in this thread. They have been saying that four tyres failed during the race.In fact there were five, the fifth being Gutierrez's front left, which also damaged his front wing.

Pirelli for reject, although a mention for Lotus team-orders, and how unoriginal they were in issuing them.

I wasn't aware that Gutierrez's front tyre failed during the race as well, but, if so, then five blowouts (six if you include Perez's blowout in the final practise session) is rather disconcerting. What is a little surprising, though, is that it was mostly the rear left tyre that was failing - though there are considerable loads in that tyre, given that it is a very fast clockwise track, I was under the impression that the front left tyre was the most heavily loaded. Indeed, if you listened to the radio messages during the race, several drivers were complaining of graining on the front left tyre rather than the rear tyres (although, that said, Pirelli did alter the rear tyre sidewall stiffness more than the front tyres for 2013).

Post by **Londoner** » 30 Jun 2013, 19:00

As much as I'm trying to find a way not to give them ROTR, I'm afraid it just has to be Pirelli.

Dishonourable mentions to:

McLaren - bloody awful again

BBC iPlayer - Got home at 4, expected the race to be avaliable very shortly. Waited three hours, then just watched the BBC highlights. What a waste of my afternoon, constantly refreshing the link, only for it to still be unavaliable.

The British media - because you just know they're gonna blow the entire Pirelli situation into something massive tomorrow...

DidNotQualify · Post by **DidNotQualify** » 30 Jun 2013, 19:01

Surely Pirelli have to take this prestigious award. Which is a shame in some ways, since this race showed what could be good about Pirelli-spec racing in terms of wear rates and mixing up some strategies. Just look at the racing after the last safety car. But there must be some serious concerns over the structural integrity of their tyres, and concern over next weekend's race as there's no real time to fix it before then.

Dishonourable mentions (with varying degrees of seriousness)

Lewis Hamilton and pit lanes: entering the pit lane the wrong side of the bollard is very Maldonado-esque. (Was it Korea 2011 where Pastor did the same thing?)
Mark Webber's start: what was that?
Giedo van der Garde: for being totally anonymous (read: slow) all weekend.
Sebastian Vettel's RB9: picked an awful time to expire.
Cheering fans when Vettel retired: like some others on here I found it a little distasteful.
Unoriginal team orders: a throwback to Hockenheim 2010 today.
Lotus strategists: potentially lost Raikkonen a podium.

Post by **Londoner** » 30 Jun 2013, 19:23

Ataxia wrote:
wsrgo wrote:5. THE BOOING BRITISH CROWD: Xenophobia reigns supreme as first Vettel is booed after a gearbox failure, and they then mete out the same treatment to Alonso because he deprived their darling of a 'heroic' podium finish (funny how people forgot Massa's charge, because IMO his charge was in no way worse than Hamilton's).

Brilliant, generalising a whole fanbase there. It's alright for the Italian fans to support Ferrari, but god forbid British fans favour the British drivers...

This.

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 30 Jun 2013, 19:35

DidNotQualify wrote:Cheering fans when Vettel retired: like some others on here I found it a little distasteful.

Okay, you know what? I'm starting to get a little sick of this, people insisting that we all have to be fully respectful of drivers. Why is this particularly rejectful now?

Alextrax52 · Post by **Alextrax52** » 30 Jun 2013, 20:52

Hey guys i'm back and i loved it. I sat next to the wellington straight where Lewis had his puncture and i loved every second of it.

My nominations

Mclaren: This is getting ludicrous. They had no answer to the Force India of Sutil again and they were helpless to defend from the Williams Cars at the end. I know we are only 8 races into the season but can we just give Mclaren ROTY and put them out of their misery?

Bunsen Jetton: That said Bunsen was just dundling around the track all day like he had no business being here. He was easily slower than Perez and was just nowhere to be honest.

The British Crowd: We are here to support EVERYONE!!!!!! in Formula 1. As much as we dislike VETTELWINSLOL he hasn't done anything to get booed. Similarly I was at the stage with many other people when Alonso was doing his interview and about half of them booed him. Just Grow up because there was no Brit on the Podium. We can't always have the results as we like them.

Force India Strategists: Sutil was dead meat in the closing laps while Di Resta couldn't do anything. They need to improve their game in this area

But ROTR just has to go to:

Pirelli: 4 tires blow ups in the race Nuff Said

go_Rubens · Post by **go_Rubens** » 30 Jun 2013, 21:45

I will be happy when McLaren get their first ROTR award this year. Outright ROTR, mind you!

roblo97 · Post by **roblo97** » 30 Jun 2013, 22:04

The only person I booed was the person who gave out the trophy for second place, because she is my local mp.
Person in question was Maria Miller, MP for Basingstoke

pasta_maldonado · Post by **pasta_maldonado** » 30 Jun 2013, 22:11

Reject of the Race has to go to Pirelli. I understand they are just following what they were told to do, but at the end of the day, they still produced those tyres and have to face the responsibility.

DOSBoot · Post by **DOSBoot** » 01 Jul 2013, 00:41

1. Pirelli: 5 blowouts in one race. What a discrace!

2. McLaren: You know you're doing bad when a midfield team beats you at you're home race.

UncreativeUsername37 · Post by **UncreativeUsername37** » 01 Jul 2013, 00:50

P I R E L L I

Onxy Wrecked · Post by **Onxy Wrecked** » 01 Jul 2013, 02:03

Pirelli, two DNFs directly tied to the tyres. I also give a dishonorable to di Resta for his weight check disaster when Sutil finished 7th and qualified 6th. Never has 9th been so rejectful.

KL-racer · Post by **KL-racer** » 01 Jul 2013, 03:18

Another easy one for me! It has to be Pirelli with these self-destructive tires! It was almost like USA 2005 all over again! Which by itself is the ultimate disgrace for the sport itself!

razta · Post by **razta** » 01 Jul 2013, 03:59

Pirelli,

and going by what Hamilton said after the race to Lee McKenzie
http://planet-f1.com/driver/3213/879956 ... acceptable

"We had that tyre test to improve the tyre and to have four blowouts is unacceptable. It's only when someone gets hurt that someone will be doing something about it. I think it's a waste of time talking to the FIA, and if they don't do anything that says a lot about them."

So much for the NSSSPMTT -Gate

go_Rubens · Post by **go_Rubens** » 01 Jul 2013, 04:10

BlindCaveSalamander wrote:
DidNotQualify wrote:Cheering fans when Vettel retired: like some others on here I found it a little distasteful.

Okay, you know what? I'm starting to get a little sick of this, people insisting that we all have to be fully respectful of drivers. Why is this particularly rejectful now?

Same here. Why now? We had the fans in Montréal booing, and now we need to complain more? The Canadians' excuse is ridiculous as well. Or it seems like it. Surely after sixteen years they would have gotten over the Schumacher vs. Villeneuve incident? I'm going off-topic, but seriously?

Now the complaining about cheering people when guys like Vettel retire. He was due some bad luck, and it came in another hot race, and the parts can't stand the heat by the looks of it. I'm personally okay with the cheering/booing.

razta · Post by **razta** » 01 Jul 2013, 04:13

There was no booing - it was cheering, a "ROAR" from the crowd, it's partisan cheer! besides who took the lead? another GERMAN.

I think it's cos everyone got bored of VETTELWINSLOL!

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 01 Jul 2013, 05:37

1 - Pirelli
2 - Pirelli Excuses

wsrgo · Post by **wsrgo** » 01 Jul 2013, 05:43

go_Rubens wrote:
BlindCaveSalamander wrote:
DidNotQualify wrote:Cheering fans when Vettel retired: like some others on here I found it a little distasteful.

Okay, you know what? I'm starting to get a little sick of this, people insisting that we all have to be fully respectful of drivers. Why is this particularly rejectful now?

Same here. Why now? We had the fans in Montréal booing, and now we need to complain more? The Canadians' excuse is ridiculous as well. Or it seems like it. Surely after sixteen years they would have gotten over the Schumacher vs. Villeneuve incident? I'm going off-topic, but seriously?

Now the complaining about cheering people when guys like Vettel retire. He was due some bad luck, and it came in another hot race, and the parts can't stand the heat by the looks of it. I'm personally okay with the cheering/booing.

If you read my ROTR nominations for Canada, you'll find I gave a dishonourable mention to the booing fans as well..

wsrgo · Post by **wsrgo** » 01 Jul 2013, 05:47

I don't remember people booing/cheering when MSC's engine blew after 5 years at Suzuka 2006...

LionZoo · Post by **LionZoo** » 01 Jul 2013, 06:24

wsrgo wrote:I don't remember people booing/cheering when MSC's engine blew after 5 years at Suzuka 2006...

That's because it happened in Japan. They probably sympathized with a very polite "zannen desu ne".

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 01 Jul 2013, 06:49

razta wrote:There was no booing - it was cheering, a "ROAR" from the crowd, it's partisan cheer! besides who took the lead? another GERMAN.

I have to agree with this. If the fans had boo'd Vettel as he got out of the car that would've been totally unacceptable but I thought the cheering/roaring was, to me at least, to be expected.

Svenko Wankerov · Post by **Svenko Wankerov** » 01 Jul 2013, 07:24

The rampant elitism in this place is amusing when it comes to the whole "respectfulness" thing. Especially since one of the people complaining about it has a quote from a moderator bashing a highly successful team manager as his signature.

The fans at Silverstone are no more "respectful" or "disrespectful" than the ones at Montreal or Monza. They were clearly cheering against Vettel more than anything. Happens with casual fans. Deal with it.

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 01 Jul 2013, 07:49

Svenko Wankerov wrote: Especially since one of the people complaining about it has a quote from a moderator bashing a highly successful team manager as his signature.

I cant be bothered to trawl through, who d'you mean?

Rusujuur · Post by **Rusujuur** » 01 Jul 2013, 08:55

Well, it has to be the tyre related problems, but I wouldn't blame Pirelli outright. Or well, in this instance I probably should, as this time it was the constructional integrity that failed, but I really would like to cut some slack as they are between a rock and a hard place right now:

1. They were asked to produce this kind of tyre by the powers that be
2. Regular fans hear the complaints and blame Prelli
3. They can't change them, because the teams that benefit (Ferrari, Lotus, FI) don't allow it
4. If they change them or change the allocation to harder we get complaints of boring racing as the end of last year showed

The forums are full of calls to bring back Michelin or Bridgestone although I am sure Pirelli could also manufacture rock hard tyres, if they were asked to do so. I wonder what the bosses are thinking as it is a PR disaster they really can't get out of any more. If I would be a Pirelli owner I would say bathplug it and quit at the end of the year blaming Bernie and Jean although even that would be bad as it would look like they weren't on top of their game.

As for the crowds cheering when Vettel had his DNF I must admit so was I ... :oops:

I have always had a driver to cheer and a driver I really hated. It used to be Schumacher as I started watching in 94 and that year really set the mood with the move on Hill and the whole "Benetton cheating" rumor mill. Then it was Alonso for a while, but I have come to respect him during the last few years for his superb skills despite his weird antics (I mean, a throne? Really?). For the last 3 years my hate has been directed towards Vettel even though he initially looked like a cool guy. I am not exactly sure what it is, but I really dislike him and it seems to be a general view in my home country as well. And mind you, Schumacher in my country was a hero, so nothing against a German in the best car who is ruthless. It must be something in his behavior or in Red Bull that puts people off.

madmark1974 · Post by **madmark1974** » 01 Jul 2013, 08:55

Unless I've got my facts wrong (which is quite possible), weren't the tyres supposed to be changed for the rest of the season from Silverstone onwards, and Pirelli had to postpone and eventually
cancel the whole idea as the teams couldn't agree on implementing the change (which Hamilton alluded to in his interview / rant) - I'm guessing Ferrari and Lotus were the ones against this - so
in some ways, although of course these incidents shouldn't be happening, they ~could~ have been prevented if Pirelli were permitted to alter the tyre construction as they proposed. If there was
a concorde agreement in place would the change have gone ahead? And why is there no concorde agreement? Because the teams couldn't agree on it.

Having said that, if I recall correctly, didn't that loose drain cover at China get ROTR for puncturing the tyres in the past? If, as the BBC suggested, there was a sharp edge on the kerbing, then
perhaps that should take ROTR, we'll have to see what Pirelli's analysis comes up with ... Either way, if the tyre construction had been altered it could have prevented all of this, so my ROTR is :

Obstinate Team Bosses

Ross Prawn · Post by **Ross Prawn** » 01 Jul 2013, 10:12

I think I have to nominate Vijay Mallya who has made a late but valiant attempt for ROTR with the following educated comments:-

"Other than the car behind and the driver who might get a bit startled with the sudden explosion in front, it really isn't a major safety issue from that point of view," http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/108477

What a star :lol:

Faustus · Post by **Faustus** » 01 Jul 2013, 11:37

roblomas52 wrote:The only person I booed was the person who gave out the trophy for second place, because she is my local mp.
Person in question was Maria Miller, MP for Basingstoke

Too right. Expenses-abusing scum.

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 01 Jul 2013, 12:13

razta wrote:There was no booing - it was cheering, a "ROAR" from the crowd, it's partisan cheer! besides who took the lead? another GERMAN.

I think it's cos everyone got bored of VETTELWINSLOL!

Pretty much this.

SeedStriker · Post by **SeedStriker** » 01 Jul 2013, 12:14

1.-Disintegrating Pirellis: For a moment, it was close to Indy-gate farce
2.-Max Chilton: Talent was missing were he most needed it

Dishonorable mentions to Christian Horner (please, STFU already!), Kimi Raikkonen (being on worn tires is not the way, Iceman) and McLaren (Checo is faster, he should've been using the upgrades)

The Why Always to Me Award goes to Felipe Massa: Silverstone has always been a nightmare for Felipinho.

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 01 Jul 2013, 12:19

SeedStriker wrote:Kimi Raikkonen (being on worn tires is not the way, Iceman)

It wasn't Kimi's call. As evidenced by him being pissed off at the strategists after the race.

Alextrax52 · Post by **Alextrax52** » 01 Jul 2013, 13:28

Jocke1 wrote:

I brought that cap from the Pirelli store in the paddock. I feel slightly ashamed i brought one now

go_Rubens · Post by **go_Rubens** » 01 Jul 2013, 13:32

Kimi-ICE wrote:
Jocke1 wrote:

I brought that cap from the Pirelli store in the paddock. I feel slightly ashamed i brought one now

Well, if they turn out to be ROTR, you can call that "Reject Merchandise!"

In all seriousness, I would have got one, but when an event like this happens, I would feel ashamed, like you are right now.

Vassago · Post by **Vassago** » 01 Jul 2013, 15:17

With so much controversy surrounding Pirelli it's a no-brainer really :roll:

Rocks with Salt · Post by **Rocks with Salt** » 01 Jul 2013, 17:42

I can't believe you're all so quick to jump on the PIRELLISUCKSWTF bandwagon after accusing them of producing boring racing at Montreal. They have been asking the FIA and the teams to let them go back to a 2012-spec tire for a while now, but the teams wouldn't allow it. They relented after the Bahrain GP and let them change the hard compound, but IIRC many of you starting screaming "Now Red Bull is gonna win everything because the tires suit them! WTF Pirelli?!" Still unhappy with the tire compound, Pirelli wanted the 2012-spec with the kevlar belt instead of the steel one after Canada, but the teams, specifically Ferrari, Lotus, and Force India, vetoed because they claimed it would hurt their competitiveness. Even if they claimed it was for safety reasons, those teams would have demanded proof (which Pirelli couldn't definitively provide) and filed a complaint with the FIA.

Pirelli has been given the short stick for years now, and when you need a patsy for when the racing is too boring or too dangerous, they're an easy scapegoat. I think the teams have no one to blame but themselves for not giving Pirelli the support and resources they have been asking for. For that reason, I give the ROTR for the British GP to Ferrari, Force India, and Lotus for vetoing the compounds Pirelli wanted before the race and afterward accusing them of making a faulty tire compound. Hypocrisy at its finest.

Hound55 · Post by **Hound55** » 01 Jul 2013, 18:26

I think I am going to have to agree. Pirelli isn't entirely at fault, but I don't believe the teams are either. They made the call to keep the tires because it would hurt their competitiveness, but also because they felt that safety wasn't as big of an issue as claimed. I don't remember that many instances of tires exploding like that (Massa in Bahrain comes to mind, but I can't think of any others), so I can't blame the teams for their apprehensiveness. Pirelli saw the same number of catastrophic tire failures as the teams did, so its not like they were particularly expectant of what happened at Silverstone.

Nobody predicted that, so it can't be anyone's fault. But, if the teams and Pirelli choose to mud-sling as opposed to cooperate following this embarrassing fiasco, then we can apply blame to the parties involved.

As a result, I'd have to give Reject of the Race to Jenson Button, because in a race of chaos, he still managed to be fairly anonymous. I was easily more impressed by his teammate that race. Shame Perez had that massive failure at the end.

Barbazza · Post by **Barbazza** » 01 Jul 2013, 21:07

Pirelli have to take it I'm afraid. Lucky that teams can't pull out on safety grounds as at Indianapolis 2005 or we'd have races with 0 cars at the moment.

I didn't particularly like the booing at Vettel but I suppose it's to be expected.
As for booing MPs - for goodness sake grow up, they were presenting a trophy, not burning £50 notes on a pyre. So they rack up expenses? Yeah probably. This has ALWAYS HAPPENED, it's politics and that's the way it works I'm afraid. I'd still rather live in democratic Britain that somewhere like Egypt or Syria at the monent!

I think the Sky commentary team deserve a mention as well. I lost count of the number of times that they called a driver wrong, especially in the first half of the race.
Crofty: "There's Ricciardo"..... Me: "No, it's clearly Vergne."
Crofty: "Vergne ahead of Raikkonen..." Me: "<Sigh> That's Ricciardo..."
etc etc

Jonny83 · Post by **Jonny83** » 01 Jul 2013, 21:13

I'm not going to nominate Pirelli, I'm going to nominate whoever watched the 2010 Canadian Grand Prix and decided it would be a good idea to artificially engineer this situation race in, race out.

Pirelli take 2nd place for agreeing to said brief.