2017 Russian Grand Prix discussion thread

[Londoner]

Engines are the talk of Sochi today. Vandoorne's managed to burn through his entire 2017 allocation of engines, and we're only at the fourth weekend. Christ, they're a total and utter embarrassment.

Meanwhile, things looks cagey at Marenello, as both Kimi and Seb are now on their third turbos. I'm wondering if this is a case of Ferrari stress-testing their engine allocation, putting a wear cycle through each unit to mitigate against having to run the same part for multiple races.

[CoopsII]

Engines are the talk of Sochi today. Vandoorne's managed to burn through his entire 2017 allocation of engines, and we're only at the fourth weekend. Christ, they're a total and utter embarrassment.

Absolutely. Might as well close the books on ROTY now, I reckon.

[Barbazza]

Going to have to watch this on catchup as we'll be away for most of the weekend! (Somehow I always seem to miss Russia, whichever time of the year it's been scheduled for!)

[mario]

Engines are the talk of Sochi today. Vandoorne's managed to burn through his entire 2017 allocation of engines, and we're only at the fourth weekend. Christ, they're a total and utter embarrassment.

Meanwhile, things looks cagey at Marenello, as both Kimi and Seb are now on their third turbos. I'm wondering if this is a case of Ferrari stress-testing their engine allocation, putting a wear cycle through each unit to mitigate against having to run the same part for multiple races.

Some of the Renault powered teams are also getting a bit close for comfort too - Kvyat is onto his third MGU-K, whilst Sainz is onto his third MGU-H.

It is true that teams do tend to cycle components in and out of the car in order to balance out wear, though it does seem a little early given that most teams tend to want to hold back a fresher power unit for the back to back races in Spa and Monza given they traditionally are the races with the longest periods on full throttle on the calendar.

At the moment, whilst Ferrari's public position is that this is just for the strategic reasons you have mentioned, they have hinted that perhaps there have been a few issues that require further analysis. That is reinforced by the fact that Kimi did have a turbocharger failure in Bahrain during the practise sessions - although the team seemed hopeful that they might be able to salvage most, if not all, of the power unit, it does nevertheless raise the question of whether they might have a slight reliability issue.

There is also the balancing issue that, whilst there is the advantage that they've balanced out the wear rate, at the same time it does limit their ability to introduce upgraded parts later in the season without incurring penalties. Indeed, Ferrari have conceded that they will inevitably only have one opportunity to introduce upgrades to the turbocharger unit later in the season without taking penalties, so it does have some downsides.

In that sense, Mercedes looks to be better set than any of the other manufacturers - all of the drivers using their engines have made the fewest component changes, so they have greater flexibility to introduce component upgrades later in the season.

As an aside, I do wonder why it is Vandoorne in particular who seems to be bearing the brunt of the reliability issues at McLaren - Alonso's not in a great position, but his component usage isn't as bad as I though it would be.

[good_Ralf]

Jesus, Jolyon.

[dinizintheoven]

Jesus, Jolyon.

"I would just like to say if I may, I have some predictions..." - Eddie Jordan, earlier today.

Say what you like about the loudmouthed old biffer but his predictions (if indeed they are that, rather than the result of some inside information) have an uncanny habit of being true. He says Fernando Alonso will be back for a third stint at Renault next season, despite McLaren's upcoming divorce with Honda.

Something tells me that Renault is theoretically capable of fourth place in the Constructors' Championship this season, provided there are two capable drivers who can deliver the maximum result. We know who the top three are, and the main two teams standing in Renault's way are Williams - hamstrung by a driver who Little Angels wrote about six years before he was even born - and Force India, whose "rookie" at least has half a season under his belt but the looming threat of financial constraints, losing the development race and their big cheese having the book thrown at him (followed by the bookcase, and the library, brick by brick) will most likely stall their progress at some stage.

What is to stop Fernando toddling off to Indy, then whatever the result, saying "later, losers" to McLaren straight afterwards and offering his services to his old pals at Enstone the same day? Surely they'd fling Jolyon Palmer on the scrapheap at a second's notice and never mind the potential buyout clauses - F1 contracts, as we know, are barely worth the paper they're printed on these days. As for the vacant McLaren seat, I'll draw the line short of predicting what might happen there if Jenson Button decides not to fill the rest of his year hauling it round to 15th place for as long as the engine stays intact.

Of course, anything I've suggested here might all change again when Mercedes figure out what they want to do with Valtteri Bottas at the end of the season...

[Wallio]

despite McLaren's upcoming divorce with Honda...

While I personally believe this to be the case, NBC says no.....

http://motorsports.nbcsports.com/2017/0 ... ne-supply/

[watka]

despite McLaren's upcoming divorce with Honda...

While I personally believe this to be the case, NBC says no.....

http://motorsports.nbcsports.com/2017/0 ... ne-supply/

If McLaren and Honda split, it will be Honda's decision as McLaren have too much to lose financially by walking away (as many have been keen to point out to me before when I've brought this up). As for the prospect of Alonso jumping ship mid-season, I'm sure Alonso would jump at the offer, but I don't see Renault going in for it. I don't think they are as close to Williams and Force India as diniz says; the Mercedes engine is still superior to Renaults and whilst Renault may outdevelop Williams and Force India in other areas, they can't really do much in the power department. Stroll will only get better over the course of the season and we've all expected Force India to collapse before and yet they've soldiered on - plus their results are often as much to do with strategy rather than outright pace. So no, I don't see Renault shelling out to secure Alonso immediately when it would far from guarantee 4th place, despite how useless Palmer is.

[Dj_bereta]

I won't be surprised if Sirotkin replaces Palmer before the end of the season.

[AdrianBelmonte_]

I won't be surprised if Sirotkin replaces Palmer before the end of the season.

Given Jolyon's form, even XMattyG (you know, the youtuber that signed for WTF1) could replace Palmer and still be faster than him

[Fetzie]

I won't be surprised if Sirotkin replaces Palmer before the end of the season.

Given Jolyon's form, even XMattyG (you know, the youtuber that signed for WTF1) could replace Palmer and still be faster than him

People drive faster than Palmer on the motorway here in Germany, and they mostly manage not to crash too...

[RAK]

Alonso out already due to unreliability and the race hasn't even started.

[UncreativeUsername37]

Absolutely nothing happened, and then what an ending. A simple, memorable little story. Seems to be what this season's about.

[AdrianBelmonte_]

[Paul Hayes]

Nice to see a new winner added to the history books!

Very well-deserved by Bottas, hanging on under that pressure. I did think with about seven laps to go that Vettel was going to have him, especially after that flat-spotting error.

[Spectoremg]

The first three stories on the BBC website about the result mention Hamilton - as opposed to Valtteri's excellent win. Total Fanbois.

[dinizintheoven]

The first three stories on the BBC website about the result mention Hamilton - as opposed to Valtteri's excellent win. Total Fanbois.

I made the mistake of revealing the comments under one of today's reports - which may or may not have been one of those three you're talking about - in which the BBC and Andrew Benson were roundly accused of having an inherent anti-Hamilton bias that was as clear as optical fibre and they had done so since 2009 at least.

Then again, even this was a bastion of decorum in comparison to the vast majority of what was written underneath the report on today's events at The Crucible. Whispering Ted Lowe will be spinning in his grave... quietly, of course. And for everyone watching in black and white, Ted's grave is the one with the yellow flowers on it, between the two graves with the pink flowers.

[Spectoremg]

The first three stories on the BBC website about the result mention Hamilton - as opposed to Valtteri's excellent win. Total Fanbois.

I made the mistake of revealing the comments under one of today's reports - which may or may not have been one of those three you're talking about - in which the BBC and Andrew Benson were roundly accused of having an inherent anti-Hamilton bias that was as clear as optical fibre and they had done so since 2009 at least.

Then again, even this was a bastion of decorum in comparison to the vast majority of what was written underneath the report on today's events at The Crucible. Whispering Ted Lowe will be spinning in his grave... quietly, of course. And for everyone watching in black and white, Ted's grave is the one with the yellow flowers on it, between the two graves with the pink flowers.

I didn't actually read the reports - the leaders irritated me enough.

[CoopsII]

Whispering Ted Lowe will be spinning in his grave... quietly, of course. And for everyone watching in black and white, Ted's grave is the one with the yellow flowers on it, between the two graves with the pink flowers.

Just snorted my tea reading that. Post of the year.

[girry]

The first three stories on the BBC website about the result mention Hamilton - as opposed to Valtteri's excellent win. Total Fanbois.

To be fair titling single race wins with Hamilton/Button is completely understandable for BBC because it's a British media house. National news outlets from other countries do exactly the same (or are even worse).

With SKY and say, motorsport.com it's of course different because they're supposed to be "world feeds"

[razta]

Gotta say.. DBTMoR has to go to Lewis Hamilton.. He was soundly beaten by Bottas properly since Free Practice... and finished a whopping 36 seconds behind him..

[mario]

The first three stories on the BBC website about the result mention Hamilton - as opposed to Valtteri's excellent win. Total Fanbois.

To be fair titling single race wins with Hamilton/Button is completely understandable for BBC because it's a British media house. National news outlets from other countries do exactly the same (or are even worse).

With SKY and say, motorsport.com it's of course different because they're supposed to be "world feeds"

I agree that there will be an element of playing to their national audiences, and I do agree that there are a number of publications which are far worse than the BBC in that respect - for example, some Dutch sites are about as balanced as a sledgehammer when it comes to Max Verstappen (and frankly feel like you are being bashed about the head with a sledgehammer at times with how unsubtle they are).

Gotta say.. DBTMoR has to go to Lewis Hamilton.. He was soundly beaten by Bottas properly since Free Practice... and finished a whopping 36 seconds behind him..

It does perhaps suggest that Mercedes's car has a narrower operating window, since we firstly saw Bottas being unusually slow in race trim in Bahrain and now Hamilton similarly off the pace in Russia. They do seem to be having a few set up problems, particularly when running in traffic (with Hamilton being warned of overheating issues even when he was comparatively far back from Kimi) - in that respect, Ferrari have an advantage as, even if Mercedes might sometimes have a slight advantage over a single lap, they seem to be have a much wider operating window that lets them maximise their performance more readily.